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| I was looking into astrological services, and was wondering what anyone here thought.
Do you think astrology has anything to offer for someone on a yogic path?
I've found it is not just about predicting the future. The Vedic realm of astrology seems to be more about seeing who you are and becoming what you want to be?
Has anybody here had any expereince with astrology? What would you look for in a reading?
Any feedback please.
John
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| Welcome to the forum John. And since you asked, I think astrology is rubbish and wouldn't waste time with it. |
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| I believe that certain moon phases might have an influence on some human's behaviour and conscience as well as lots of sunshine makes your hormones go whoopie. But that's more astrophysical and biological stuff. Astrology in itself I for one find is pure and utter nonsense.
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| I don't know anything about Vedic astrology, I assume it's much more in-depth than the little blurbs in the Sunday paper! People have been looking to the stars for answers for thousands of years, surely they must have gotten something right once in a while or else nobody would be looking anymore!
I think it's kind of like tarot or runes or palm-reading or any other way to predict the future. You take from it what sounds true and right, and leave the rest. Maybe it's another way to get at the messages we need to hear, our teachers are all around us you know! And besides that, sometimes it's just fun to play with!
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Extreme Veteran
Posts: 517
Location: New Jersey | I don't think astrology can be taken too seriously. While it can be fun, and you can learn a little about yourself by studying your sign, I think some people read a little too deeply into it and it can be misleading. I think the stars and the cycles of the moon do affect us in some ways, but I don't wholeheartedly believe in astrology.
Samantha |
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| Speaking of Astrology blurbs I had a funny one recently. They were giving a romance/exercise prediction (heaven knows why) I read that of my Daughter, Son then wife, and had the usual good laugh about how far off the mark they were. Then I got to mine. The romance was a laugh since it predicted that I was unstable in relationships (I guess 25 years is unstable. LOL) But then it said for exercise you should do yoga and meditation.
Hey even a roulette wheel can get something right every now and then.
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| MrD - 2005-02-05 12:00 AM
Hey even a roulette wheel can get something right every now and then.
The roulette wheel is always right - it's the gambler who errs!!! 
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| Wow, pretty negative response...
I remeber reading "Autiobiography of Yogi" and how Yogananda was so much against astrology. But his guru counselled: "It's not a matter of belief, but of science. Gravity was just as effective before Newton discovered as before." Or something like that...
In the field of Vedic Astrology I've seen some pretty incredible responses. Traditional Indian philosophy was not so fate orientated. It was more about painting a picture of one's life and helping them move through the obstacles...
My investigation so far as shown me it seems to suffer more from distortion and charlatans. That in it's more rare and pure sense it can be a powerful tool. But it is an intuitional art and probably needs very advanced people to practice it wihout being misleading...
Any more thoughts?
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| I very much agree with it as an intuitional tool, as long as people look at it that way. In that sense, any of the "predictional arts" could be considered valid. Intuition is a very powerful force that most people ignore because there's no way to harness it or prove its worth.
Most of these tools have gotten a bad reputation due to disreputable practitioners taking advantage of people who are lost and desperate for someone to show them the way (or for someone to talk to). You could say the same for other professions, although this one is probably the most extreme.
I have visited psychics (my mom used to be friends with a lot of them - don't ask), and some were full of hooey while others said things that hit home. Others often came away with the exact opposite impression! I don't know whether these people actually received messages I could not hear, or if they were simply picking up on my body language and telling me things I should already know about myself. I don't think it matters, as long as I got something out of it.
It's all in how you approach the messages you receive, and how you use that information. To me, it's just another tool to understand yourself and your path better. The form of the messenger makes no matter.
Jean
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| For a real Yoga Student, there is NO benefit to be obtained by the Study of Astrology. Otherwise, the great sages such as Patanjali would not have missed that as one of the limbs of Study.
However, if you are a student of Astrology, you have no choice but to study it.
Neel kulkarni
www.authenticyoga.org |
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Expert Yogi
Posts: 2479
  
Location: A Blue State | And if you don't study it, your teacher will not be happy with you! |
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| I think Astrology can be really valuable, not just on the yogic path, but for anyone who's interested in getting to know themselves more intimately.
Astrology has almost nothing to do with the horoscopes you read in the paper. True astrology is a very intricate science and quite specific. Your sun sign is only one of many significant areas of a birth chart.
I know that for me, having my chart interpretted by a true, scholarly and quite scientific astrologer was a real breakthrough for me. It explained ALOT about the way I move, feel, think, believe, and gave me valuable information about how to integrate these energies. |
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| Google "cold reading" if you have a minute. There's a few links to interresting articles in the skeptic's dictionary. We are all different in some ways or another, our backgrounds, what we do, where we live, what we believe in etc... But I think there is a lot of value in Maslow's pyramid of needs. We need to eat, shelter etc ... and then seek self realization when the more basic needs are fulfiled. That makes us very like one another. Most of us are looking for emotional fulfilment, health, status, in various degrees and at various stages of our life. Therefore, it cannot be that hard for an astrologer, palm reader, tarot reader et al , to "hit the nail" once in a while. Bear in mind that most people would remember the one or two "hits" the astrologer will get through clever questionning and vague statements, not the misses or near misses. Then, sprinkle in a bit of statistics on demographics and hey presto, you have a reading! The line of questionning would be different for a 70 year old lady than for a young man in his thirties. Amazingly enough, the older lady is seeking reassurance about her late husband, and the lad about relationships, his elderly parents and his career. Ditto, clothes, shape of the hands, elocution, would reveal information about that person social status, hence their potential "evolution on the pyramid", that could be used by the "practitioner" in finding out what the person may be looking for, lacking of etc ... Wow, what a feast of supernatural divinative talent...
So what's the difference between a "scientific" astrologer, and a palm reader on a christmas fair? Market segementation?
Edited by frog71_uk 2005-02-09 4:39 AM
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| frog71_uk - 2005-02-10 3:36 PM
Wow, what a feast of supernatural divinative talent...
So what's the difference between a "scientific" astrologer, and a palm reader on a christmas fair? Market segementation?
Call it Vertical markets.. 
From the ancient times there has been people who have learnt astrology by using mathematical calculations. When you think of other fortunetelling methods such as tarot cards I feel like Astrology is more scientific. But there are so many doubts about it., In Indian countries people believe loot in Astrology., When 2 people are getting married, parents give their blessings only if the horoscopes are matched (Horoscope is the thing which has all the info about all the starts and planet combinations of your birth.) Otherwise the game is over Horoscope is prepared by a astrologer based on a persons birth time., But I done know how accurate this is. Coz if it’s a operation, mother can ask the doctor to take the baby at any time she wants. So I don’t know., But some times I wonder about astrocenter.com. . Some times it seems accurate  But cant say these things are really true .. I don’t know. Somebody has to work hard to build his or her own future., Stars and planets will not do that much unless you are an ET...
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| kulkarnn - 2005-02-09 9:49 PM
For a real Yoga Student, there is NO benefit to be obtained by the Study of Astrology. Otherwise, the great sages such as Patanjali would not have missed that as one of the limbs of Study.
However, if you are a student of Astrology, you have no choice but to study it.
Neel kulkarni
www.authenticyoga.org
Kulkarnn I agree with you., Once I asked a monk about Buddha’s view on Astrology. What he said was "Aththano aththanomathatha, kin kahaththi tharaka -Unless you help yourself what can stars do for you.??.."
Anyway Astrology has nothing to do with yogic path.
Edited by Thushara 2005-02-09 6:26 AM
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| Kulkarnn I agree with you., Once I asked a monk about Buddha’s view on Astrology. What he said was "Aththano aththanomathatha, kin kahaththi tharaka -Unless you help yourself what can stars do for you.??..
Darling Thushara: I want to give one comment here, without any offense to you. First, we should not use the word View in cases of realized souls such as Buddha. View is an opinion which is short of Realization. In case of incarnations such as Lord Rama, Lord Krishna, Buddha (and, by the way, Buddha was an Incarnation of Vishnu, and that will be a big thread and it is writtne in the Texts, Hindu as well as Buddhistic. I do not think I want to contribute much to that thread.), this is not a View, but a Statement of Truth, called as mahaavaakyam. My next comment is: when big teachers make certain statements, they are many times contextual, and are not to be taken literally. Literal statements are given in Shastras (sciences) such as Patanjali Yogashastra. Whereas other Spiritual Texts contain truths which are contextual. For example, in the above statement, there is importance and stress on that ONE should focus on one's Spiritual Practice and not worry about starts too much. It is not that starts are doing anything for you or against you. Stars do have a relation in the events which happen. For example, Sun does actually provide solar power which is must for sustenance of life on the earth, without any doubt. Same with all other stars, and the science of astrology is a true science. But, focussing on it too much leads the student away from Spirituality because Stars effect is on the Material Universe, called as Prakriti. And, spiritual student wants to get beyond the material universe.
Love and Peace
neel |
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Expert Yogi
Posts: 5098
Location: Somewhere in the Mountains of Western NC | Namaskar` Neel,
My husband refers to something in the Hindu culture called the Kundali (sp?) This is something that is done in his culture in the temple where the priests can tell certain things about your future, your life, past and present, etc. and it's done usually by a family priest starting when the children are young. Everyone has their own Kundali. The way I understand it, it's very spiritual - not something that's glamorous and silly. Also, the Tibetans have a similar system. If you have ever seen the French movie "Himalaya" they were trying to make a trip and wouldn't go until the day given by the astrologer..except they didn't call it that, it was something else which I don't know because all my Tibetan friends are celebrating Losar right now and I can't ask. In the movie they left on the day they weren't suppose to and all hell broke loose, yaks fell off the sides of mountains and a bad snow storm came upon them, etc. Native American Indians had a similar thing...of course they stayed together in tribes and the elders & chief's made the decisions.
I'd like to think that since we are Yogi's we don't need to rely on things like astrology and others (in America we have the news:~) We rely on innerselves. Its just really hard sometimes convincing my American children to trust me, not everyone else since this society conditions everyone to rely on external things....but the good news is that my children are learning my way and they are starting to see it...FINALLY!! My son is in his first year of college and has had some pretty interesting experiences. I'm so proud that he has his own mind and is strong when it comes to others trying to influence him. His teachers like his uniqueness too and he makes really good grades in his writing especially.
Happy Losar and Chinese New Year - the year of the wood bird and Rooster. This is suppose to be a good year for Chef's and it's a year that everyone will be working hard at what they do. |
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| Yes Dear Cyndi:
I know what Kundali is. It is an astrological chart which shows the positions of the planets at the exact time of your birth. A really true astrologer can predict many events in one's life by analysis of this Kundali. Currently, a computer program is also available. However, all that depends on how accurate the Kundali is. Anyway, all the events predicted are what shall happen in the Material World. It can NOT state how much spiritual progress the person shall make. It however can state that his person is very spiritual and shall have intense spiritual liking. And, most of the predictions are material such as how much weaoth one shall have, how many children one shall get. This is NOT spiritual. Spiritual means how much that person will come out of the material dependence in the mind. To know what spiritual means, you may refer to my 'Guide To Spirituual Life' booklet.
I am very happy to know and am proud of your family. I wish you all the best.
Neel Kulkarni
www.authenticyoga.org |
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Expert Yogi
Posts: 2479
Location: A Blue State |
And I thought that Kundalini was a serpent that lives at the base of my spine....  |
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| I don't think astrology should automatically be cast aside from the yogic path. After all, Vedic astrology has its true foundation in Ayurvedic sciences, which are surely intimately tied with yogic lifestyle?
I think anything that has the ability to illuminate the true self and essence can be a valuable tool in yoga, since the point is to see past and through illusion and gaze at the inner self.
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Expert Yogi
Posts: 2479
Location: A Blue State |
Usually, when I look at the stars I see constellations (Orion at this time of year for example).
I never have found a single thing in the stars to tell me about my life. If they look especially
beautiful, then I feel serene and relaxed. It's like lying under the sky on a warm summer
night, looking for meteors... |
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| Kulkarnn., I really appreciate your advice and thanks a lot to you.You are a cool teacher One day when you come to India with your wife, Im sure I will come to one of your Yoga workshops
1.
kulkarn We,Theravada Buddhists wont accept the fact that Lord Buddha is an Incarnation of L.Vishnu.( hmmm…Yeahh may be there is a possibility who knows...), But If Lord Vishnu is such a great person, didn’t he stop his infinite loop of rebirth as Lord Vishnu? Why he had to have another birth as Lord Buddha and improve his mind to attained Nirwana ? And Lord Vishnu is a god., But Lord Buddha was a normal person who really worked hard to improve his mind to achieve the highest goal a person could ever achieve.
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Yes I agree with you Kulkarnn., It has a more deeper meaning than how my translation looks like..It might be misleading.. Im sorry ..What you say is very true.
But for Counties like SL, Astrology had become a real pain.. When a child doesn’t study., mother goes and check his horoscope and say .. Oh.. he cant study because he has some bad planetary combinations.. When their daughter or son start a love affair, they go and check the horoscopes and if its not matching they don’t give permission.. its really stupid., But lot of people don’t understand things unless you say “Yes” or “No” directly .. You know what I mean …
Edited by Thushara 2005-02-09 11:44 PM
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| Bay Guy - 2005-02-10 9:31 AM
Usually, when I look at the stars I see constellations (Orion at this time of year for example).
I never have found a single thing in the stars to tell me about my life. If they look especially
beautiful, then I feel serene and relaxed. It's like lying under the sky on a warm summer
night, looking for meteors...
AHHAAAA... Bay guy is looking at stars and singing..
Twinkle, Twinkle, Little Star.....
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| Dear Thushara:
Where are you in India my dear? I am coming there in June and would be very interested in meeting you.
About your Shree Vishnu Question: The incarnation takes place to help people out. Incarnation takes the form which is needed for that particular job. Some are partial incarnations and some are full. Only Lord Krishna was a full incarnation, which means that he was perfect from the birth and all his actions are miraculous for other, not for him, and he nevver got into atttachment of the world, did not need any studies for learning (his teacher Sandipani said he is honored by his student Krishna, etc.). Rama came in a human form and showed how a householder should lead a life with all things related to a family life. Buddha was NOT a full incarnation and his purpose was to give the message of Ahimsa and Satya, leading to Nirvana. Lastly, Vishnu is NOT a person like you and me. When incarnated Vishnu is perceived as a person through one or more bodies.
I agree with the stupidity of persons who go to Astrologers for improving school grades, etc. However, that is what they believe and know. I find it more stupid of modern men going to Doctors for various illnesses.
And, that is why I like Brother Bay Guy, who is now singing below stars.
Neel Kulkarni
www.authenticyoga.org |
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Expert Yogi
Posts: 8442
| Cyndi - >>a good year for Chef's<< Really? My daughter is a cook who will be going to school soon to train as a chef. She will be happy to hear this! Also, she just sent in an audition tape for the Food Network. They are having a talent search contest. So I should run out and get my stars read (or hers!) or perhaps have her get out her tarot cards to see if she will soon be rich and famous! I would love to have one of my kids get rich and famous (or at least rich) so I could retire early and do more yoga  |
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Expert Yogi
Posts: 5098
Location: Somewhere in the Mountains of Western NC | Thank you Neel,
You said that "the Kundali can state that this person is very spiritual and shall have intense spiritual liking"....I guess that is what I meant as well when I said that it was a spiritual thing because if a person knew this at a very young age then that person say would be a great candidate for studying and practicing to be a Yogi (not saying that anyone couldn't because of their Kundali not being in favor of) but because of the person's kundali stating that he/she had an intense spiritual liking would be more apt to stay on a spiritual path in this lifetime and the Kundali would be very useful. The reason I say this is because so many people get on the path and then decide later its not where they should be. If we had this information in advance, then I think it would be beneficial for someone to live their life in a way that was meant for them rather than trying be something that wasn't say natural for them. I'm sure that in the olden' days say thousands of years ago this was how they determined who was going to be a Yogi in the family and who was not. As for having a computer program...yea, right. Personally, I feel it's really a lost art as far as determining the Kundali and Astrology and I am very cautious about who I receive that kind of information from.
My husband's family priest told his Mother that he was suppose to be a Yogi....she however, couldn't part with her favorite son, but left him in the temple on and off for several months over a period of years and he had a very special relationship with his Guru. He did however, come back home to live his life and then later to find me here in America:~) I am very lucky to have Satyam as my husband - he's a very special person. He has this really exeptional voice and can sing. The priest's always makes his sing Bhajans when we go to the temple.
Take care,
Cyndi |
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Expert Yogi
Posts: 5098
Location: Somewhere in the Mountains of Western NC |
Cyndi - >>a good year for Chef's<< Really? My daughter is a cook who will be going to school soon to train as a chef. She will be happy to hear this!
This is what my really, really good Chinese friend and Chef told me when I was visiting his restaurant last. Now, as far as getting the cards read..thats another story. In general, yes, this is the Chinese Traditional New Year meaning for the Year of the Rooster. So perhaps she has more in favor for her in studying "real hard" at becoming a chef simply because of doing during this year. The working "really hard" is part of the terrain too as far as this year goes too!! Reason being because Roosters work really hard at gathering food - in fact that is all they do is peck for food, might be too much for us humans to deal with, LOL!!!! I only want to work real hard at my Yoga practice because that Standing Separate Leg Head to Knee posture is bothering me and I'm trying to get there!! |
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| Cyndi:
That means your family is Satyam (H), Shivam (S), and Sundaram (U)!!!
What a bhajan family!!! Hats off I mean Namaste to all of you.
Neel Kulkarni
www.authenticyoga.org |
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Expert Yogi
Posts: 2479
Location: A Blue State |
Have you ever noticed the stars to sing back to you?
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| Yeah I have !
Edited by Thushara 2005-02-10 10:27 PM
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| kulkarnn - 2005-02-11 8:46 AM
Cyndi:
That means your family is Satyam (H), Shivam (S), and Sundaram (U)!!!
What a bhajan family!!! Hats off I mean Namaste to all of you.
Neel Kulkarni
www.authenticyoga.org
Satyam Shivam Sundaram..//... Wow like it .. There is an old song like that too.. Sung by Latha Mangeshkar if I’m not mistaken... its lovely
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| kulkarnn - 2005-02-11 9:04 PM
Dear Thushara:
Where are you in India my dear? I am coming there in June and would be very interested in meeting you.
And, that is why I like Brother Bay Guy, who is now singing below stars.
Neel Kulkarni
www.authenticyoga.org
Im not in India Kulkarnn., Im in SL., But my mother is planning to visit Buddhagaya, Lumbini and some other places in India .. Errrr…. Sort of pilgrimage I should say .(She has mastrered Pali, Sanskrit, Indian History and buddhism) ..... I thought of taking a vacation, go with her and involved in some yoga workshops while she does her things.. Otherwise its so boring.. But everything depends on my work schedule.. Its quite pressurizing these days…  Where are you going to be? In kerala ??
Edited by Thushara 2005-02-11 2:14 AM
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Expert Yogi
Posts: 5098
Location: Somewhere in the Mountains of Western NC | Lumbini is not in India anymore...it's in Nepal. Satyam (Sam) was born in Lumbini. I wouldn't go to that district right now...Nepal is in a serious crisis. In fact, near that district just yesterday, the Maoist broke over 150 rebel prisoners out of jail, and it was a big mess. I really want to go to Nepal, but not while this is going on. Too much fighting going on. But I do say Hail to the King!! - I hope he can bring some peace. |
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| Thushara:
If you are going to Bodhagaya in the June/July timeframe, I am able to join you. Also, Nepal side excluding the Lumbini. I shall be in Pune/Kerala/Bombay/NorthIndia/everywhere.
Neel Kulkarni
www.authenticyoga.org |
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Expert Yogi
Posts: 5098
Location: Somewhere in the Mountains of Western NC | kulkarnn - 2005-02-10 9:46 PM
Cyndi:
That means your family is Satyam (H), Shivam (S), and Sundaram (U)!!!
What a bhajan family!!! Hats off I mean Namaste to all of you.
Huh??? Okay, I admit this...I'm totally stumped and need some assistance in trying to figure this out. I understand the Bhajan family part:~) .....and I think I understand the Satyam part and the H meaning him, If that is the case the U would be me....the Shivam (S) and the Sundaram is making me crazy and I have a feeling that I'm totally wiped out here....Help me understand this puleezzee, LOL!
Cyndi - who is totally humbled and dumbfounded Did I mention that I am a proud to be blonde too, LOL!!!!!!
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Expert Yogi
Posts: 5098
Location: Somewhere in the Mountains of Western NC | Namaste` Neel, This is so interesting...I finally spoke with Satyam today, I'm out of town and he was working all day. Guess what?? This is the story of how he and his brothers got their name. Satyam was named first by his Mother. Then later 2 more brothers came into the family. One day the entire family visited a Yogi in his ashram. This Yogi told his Mother and Father to name the 2 other brothers Sundaram (we call him Suman) and Shivam. Shivam died when he was 4 years old from Malaria. Seems like little Shivam was an interesting little character. He used to take everything off his Mother's alter. He would then sit on it telling his Mother to do my puja - I'm a God. Okay, back to that other meaning....I know that Shivam means Master Soul, higher than truth. Satyam means truth, and Sundaram means Uttam - so beautiful than can only be imagined..another words you can imagine it so beautiful but it can't be seen. The only thing I see is that you knew something about my family?? Well?? Is there something else I should know about?? Cyndi - who thinks there is an Indian story/epic about 3 brothers behind all of this. |
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| Dear Sister Cyndi:
Satyam means your husband, Sundaram means you, the beautiful, and Shivam means your child son. Now, since you told the real story, let me tell you, I am that Shivam = Neelakantha (Neel short name) Kulkarni. My parents prayed to Lord Shiva and I was born within 9 months.
Brother
neel kulkarni
www.authenticyoga.org |
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Expert Yogi
Posts: 5098
Location: Somewhere in the Mountains of Western NC | Namaste` and Thank you Neel Bhai, That was a great story....I knew there was more. But, we are still not finished. My daughter, Kristina. Satyam was very happy to hear this and he says: "Aum tatpurukhaya bid may he maha devia dimayhee tan`na rudra prachodayat Shanti Shanti Shanti" Your Bahin Cyndi & Bhai Satyam
Edited by Cyndi 2005-02-12 8:23 AM
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| OK CyndiBahin:
tat purushaaya vidmahe mahaadevaaya dheemahi tanno rudrah prachodayaat.
I know that Purusha (Universal Soul), I meditated on that Enormous God Mahaadeva, may that Rudrah (with awesome form) inspire me.
Kristina sounds like little Krishna who might be naughty.
Neel Kulkarni
www.authenticyoga.org |
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| Casual Rising - 2005-02-05 8:36 PM
I was looking into astrological services, and was wondering what anyone here thought.
Any feedback please.
John
Sorry, I know it's a bit late now but I just couldn't resist ...
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Expert Yogi
Posts: 2479
Location: A Blue State | kulkarnn - 2005-02-12 10:50 PM
tat purushaaya vidmahe mahaadevaaya dheemahi tanno rudrah prachodayaat.
I know that Purusha (Universal Soul), I meditated on that Enormous God Mahaadeva, may that Rudrah (with awesome form) inspire me.
Neel Kulkarni
www.authenticyoga.org
What is the source of this? Krishna Das sings a lovely version of it.
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Expert Yogi
Posts: 5098
Location: Somewhere in the Mountains of Western NC | BayGuy, "Om, tat purushaaya vidmahe mahaadevaaya dheemahi tanno rudrah prachodayaat".
This is Shiva's Gyatri Mantra - the big mantra for Shiva. Namaste` Cyndi |
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| Dear BG:
Souce = Rudram, a mantra filled prayer from Vedic Literature.
Neel Kulkarni
www.authenticyoga.org |
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Expert Yogi
Posts: 2479
Location: A Blue State |
Thanks, guys.
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