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| If you walked into a yoga studio and saw a class called, Flow, what would you expect it to resemble? In general.
Eric
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| Flow or Vinyasa Flow Yoga is any type of Yoga that flows from pose to pose. It often combines various elements of both Iyengar and Astanga Yoga, as well as other systems, into a flow with great importance usually given to the breath. It can be done at normal room temperature or as a "hot" practice. Flow Yoga can have almost any philosophical basis as it is more about how you practice your Yoga than what you believe. There are an almost infinite number of possible “Flow” sequences and some practitioners also practice “Intuitive Flow,” which is flowing from one pose to the next without any plan whatsoever, following your intuition. In a class setting, the teacher usually has a sequence of poses that they lead the class through. These may be different with each class or always the same. In a personal practice of Flow Yoga, you can choose a particular sequence of poses (which you design or which you learned from a teacher) to fit what you need at that particular time. It can be vigorous or calming, fast or slow, athletic or restorative. Classes can be highly structured or free depending on the studio and teacher. | |
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| generally speaking, i would expect vinyasa, but i generally associate it more with an anusara way of flowing rather than an astanga way of flowing.
so, by this i mean that it's more of a 'slow vinyasa' rather than a 'regular paced' vinyasa. in a slow flow vinyasa, we might see this: from warrior I, bring hands to floor as you exhale. inhale, lift your chest to begin transitioning to plank. exhale, come into plank. inhale again in plank, exhale as you push back to downward dog. inhale, look up at hands, exhale, step the foot forward. inhale lift your chest, exhale, bring the back foot into position for warrior I. inhale, lift the chest reaching arms back, exhale and find balance. inhale to warrior I. hold warrior I for 3-5-8 breaths, before slow-flowing back to downward dog.
at least, the 'flow' classes that i've been to have been like this.
other flow classes also omit chaturanga, updog, downdog completely--moving between standing postures, seated postures, etc, in a flowing way. | |
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| Thank you for that.
The owner of our studio was suggesting that I change the name of my class to beginners Ashtanga. I think the reason she is asking, is that the other teacher teaches "flow" too. Well her classes are more like what I call, Hatha Yoga. They don't seem to flow. Not that they aren't good, because they are. But my classes fit your idea of Flow and her's do not.
any other opinions?
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| Thank you for your reply.
There's a little power struggle right now between teachers.
I think this came from either: the other flow teachers, or a new student that came to my class yesterday and left early.
On our website, Flow is suggested for beginners... So, it could be that they want me to change my name because I'm the tougher flow teacher or something like that... My flow classes are packed and I don't think I should have to change. | |
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| Why not call it 'Eric's tough flow class' then no one will be confused.
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| Then I would lose my perfect ratio of 10 women to 1 man. Maybe "Sweaty Flow." Sounds terrible, doesn't it? Actually we do not list who is teaching on the schedule, but the students know that I teach on Tuesdays...
Seriously though, the other teacher said this to me yesterday. (she takes my class). I was late getting there and they said students were starting to wonder if the other teacher was substituting..
This teacher said students were getting worried that I wasn't going to be teaching. And, I've had students walk out when they know I'm not. I don't want to fight over students, but I feel that my class is more flow than their flow! Plus, I do vary the intesity of my flow class.
Why would we change the name of the most successful flow class to something else?
The only benefit for me would be maybe a jump in my ashtanga class, but I adjust all the time teaching ashtanga. And, it wipes me out when we have a packed room. | |
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| i get what you mean. i've had these 'politics' happen to me too.
when a studio owner suggests i change the name of my class, i ask them for suggestions as to what to call it. usually, the storm has blown over before a week is up, and it stays the same.
in one instance where names were changed, it was the other class that was changed. i asked the studio owner to take my class and then give suggestion as to what to call it--as i was perfectly happy calling it "flow." (not the name, btw!) the other teacher in question felt that my class was "harder, and not a 'true' flow class." and thus needed a name change.
so, the studio owner came to class and said "ok, this is a flow class--so what was the other teacher on about?" i suggested that the studio owner take that teacher's class, and perhaps that class should change names. she did so and that class did change names because, the SO asserted, it wasn't a "flow" class in the sense that she understood it.
i like to put these things back on the people making a fluff--the SO, student, or other teacher--because it really isn't my issue. I'm happy to change the name if the SO decides it would be better to call it "beginners astanga" rather than "flow"--but honestly it does make a difference as to how clients percieve the classes, who will be taking it, etc. it will have both positive and negative impacts.
and why should i be the one who has to bear that burden, when it's really someone else's problem?
so, i put the problem square onto them--instead of taking it on as "oh, i'm the one teaching wrong. ok, we'll rename it or i have to teach it like you teach it." no, IMO, it's their problem--they change names or they change the teaching style. if they change my name, fine, but only after careful consideration as to whether or not the other "flow" classes are 'really flow' or not and what those teachers should come up with to call their classes or how they teach.
KWIM?
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| thanks for the insight Zoebird.
I'm handling it via email right now, which might not be the best thing to do.
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| Why not call your class Intermediate or Advanced Flow? Or they could call their class Gentle Flow! I teach a "Flow" class. I have 1 man for every 2 to 3 women. Everyone sweats as it is usually a vigorous class. (Sometimes I do a restorative class and if there are only 4 or 5 students, I will often do a Iyengar style class where we really work on just a couple poses without "flow".) Most of the students are in good shape and come on a regular basis. I have all ages from 18 to 78 and give modifications for those who need them. Class size is usually between 8 and 20.
Edited by jimg 2007-08-01 3:42 PM
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| Something like Sun Salutations.
TampaEric - 2007-08-01 1:26 PM
If you walked into a yoga studio and saw a class called, Flow, what would you expect it to resemble? In general.
Eric
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| I like the idea of the other teacher changing her class to gentle yoga, but I don't see her class as flow. I'm feeling more like Zoebird. Kinda putting the responsibility back on the owner.
My classes are pretty similiar to yours JimG. I usually have maybe 5 guys in a class of 25.
Most of the guys were towed in by their partners. I can't figure out why women gavitate to my class and most men tend to avoid my flow class in favor of bikram.
Ashtanga draws in more men, usually. | |
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| I think that the word "flow" may sound somewhat effeminate to many men. Although my class is flow, I call it Hatha Yoga. Names like power yoga appeal to many men. The men who come to my classes are people who were referred because of back problems or want stress reduction, men who are athletes and want to lengthen their muscles, develop balance and flexibility, and of course the men whose wives or girl friends bring them. Most of them keep coming because they find it to be a really good workout. They frequently mention how they do better at sports without injuries and have more energy once they start being a regular. Their other yoga class choice where I teach is a woman teacher whose classes are not so demanding, so I don't have to compete with Bikram. | |
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Expert Yogi
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| This is why I love being an Iyengar teacher. Level I, Level II, Level III, Level IV. We offer "Intro" (Level I with shorter classes and shorter terms - i.e. cheaper for people to try) through our local rec centre and that causes enough confusion  | |
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| How about suggesting you both change..... suggest using beginners and intermediate vinyasa yoga perhaps?
Fee | |
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| Hey Tampa: All these political struggles and all continue. Do not worry about them. And, do not also worry about Levels and such. You do what you think is best for you. The jobs always change, they do not go by one logic always. Why all this worry? It is always either 'economics' or 'name/fame'. If you are good in work, you will get both sufficiently, you do not have to get them maximum.
If money is falling short, as I told int he past, find something which shall compliment, or support in a stable way, so that Yoga work can Flow Smooth. After all, you are a flow master.
TampaEric - 2007-08-01 2:18 PM
Thank you for your reply.
There's a little power struggle right now between teachers.
I think this came from either: the other flow teachers, or a new student that came to my class yesterday and left early.
On our website, Flow is suggested for beginners... So, it could be that they want me to change my name because I'm the tougher flow teacher or something like that... My flow classes are packed and I don't think I should have to change. | |
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| tourist:
i leveled out the classes at the Y--talk about a huge mess. People who belong in level 1 show up for level 2. people who belong in intro, show up in level 2. everyone signs up for level 2.
i had a post-op grannie sign up for level 2! i wish people would just sign up for intro or level 1. LOL! | |
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| Concept of Levels 1 to 5 works mostly in Asana study. It does not work with Meditation and other Yoga topics. Thus, in my opinion, as a whole, it does not work. | |
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Expert Yogi
Posts: 8442
| True, Neel. I believe in Pune they only have beginners and advanced. And THEY choose which class you go to, not you. | |
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| My first reason was defensive.
Today, I'm leaning more toward your logic...
Flow master, haha...
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| Why not call yours dynamic yoga flow? or power yoga? Ive been to yoga flow classes that havent flowed in a way that I teach flow, (which is like everyone else has described). Is your class like ashtanga vinyasa?
Tourist -
My friend did a class in purple valley and the first pose she did was headstand, the second scorpian???
Teaching with levels doesnt work, everyone does 3 or 4 classes and think they should be in intermediate, everyone seems to believe theyre more advanced than what they are, its so hard to get through plus you have got to have enough students to fill both classes.
Neel meditation is the ideal - if I was to put a meditaion only class on in the gym it would be almost empty, I have to give them juicy asana first whilst spoon feeding philosophy and meditation, for most westerners its the only route.
Edited by raquel 2007-08-02 5:00 PM
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Location: Upstate NY | Om Eric, It is not the strongest of the species that survives, nor the most intelligent, but the one most responsive to change. -Charles Darwin Don't sweat it............. just go with the "flow"  my man! We all tend to hold onto things too tightly and are resitant to change......... honestly it's the name of a class, in the grand scheme of life is the name of a yoga class that big of a deal? just food for thought, take it for what it is......... good luck! Mucho Metta, Ravi | |
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| Teacher choosing the class = Best Method for Student and Teacher both!
tourist - 2007-08-02 12:32 PM
True, Neel. I believe in Pune they only have beginners and advanced. And THEY choose which class you go to, not you. | |
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Expert Yogi
Posts: 8442
| Yes, we do dictate largely which classes our students can take. They can move to Level II more or less when they think they are ready, although we will get on them to move ahead if they stay in Level I too long, but other levels require permission. If they want 3 or 4 classes a week, they have to fit into our schedule  | |
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| Not to be a stick in the mud, even though it's my role, but...
there seems to be a lot of drama at your particular studio.
what do you suppose is the catalyst for that?
TampaEric - 2007-08-01 11:18 AM
Thank you for your reply.
There's a little power struggle right now between teachers.
I think this came from either: the other flow teachers, or a new student that came to my class yesterday and left early.
On our website, Flow is suggested for beginners... So, it could be that they want me to change my name because I'm the tougher flow teacher or something like that... My flow classes are packed and I don't think I should have to change. | |
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| there is a lot of drama in the different studios that i've worked for as well.
what i find is that i commonly deal with people's insecurities.
for my own part, i feel that i'm relatively secure in myself overall. yes, i have my 'spots.' but, for the most part, i do pretty well.
when it comes to teaching yoga, i'm not really attached to what i'm doing or what other teachers are doing. i'm not in a comparison game and i really don't think about it much. i go into a classroom and teach what i teach.
what i often find is that newer teachers and often sometimes studio owners as well are insecure in their own teaching when they compare themselves to what i'm doing in my classroom. this often leads them into dramas that don't necessarily involve me--which is why i strive to 'put it back on them.'
it's not reactionary, defensive, or aggressive, it's just putting the locus of the problem squarely on the locus of the problem.
i find that this reduces the drama on the whole. instead of saying 'no, i'm not changing it' or "yes, i'm changing it" i decide instead to say "why not take some time as a group and come up with a solution."
this often gives plenty of time for people to manage their insecurity, to work through their concerns, and create new ways to relate. it often decreases drama over time. | |
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| Thanks Ravi.
I was trying to build a case, now I think I should just go with the flow, right?
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| I probably should keep specifics down since this is a public place.
A staff meeting would probably solve most of the issues.
It really is a wonderful place on many levels. Great space, great teachers, great students, etc..
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| Very insightful.
Thanks for taking the time to post that. | |
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| I think its quite important that the students know what theyre letting themselves in for, I mean I just couldnt imagine calling all of my classes simply yoga, I would for certain have arthritic mature students turning up for ashtanga and then what?? There needs to be some sort of definition to set it apart from other classes being taught. If your class is stronger and the other teacher wants to call hers a flow class, then give extra definition to the type of flow you teach, theres no harm done shes happy, your happy and the students know what to expect so theyre happy and thats all that matters.
I think your mantra "go with the flow" is perfect for this situation | |
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| raquel:
you bring up an interesting point, but i also see some other things in relation to this. 
first, i find that labelling makes a difference. people who want to take "yoga" but don't know what it is may be put off by a certain label such as "power yoga." i had a woman take my class on thursday (first time i've taught that class at that time at that place), and it was labeled "power yoga" (their choice). after taking the class (that was not "power yoga" as i would define it--i taught it according to the level of those present), she said "i think i need to take beginners first" even though she did great, the class was 'beginners' and all of that. she said that she was "scared" to take power yoga, and that she was "surprised she managed to do the class." after class, another woman asked if there was a "beginners class" because she doesn't want to take "power yoga" first thing.
i get that, i really do. And then, you also have people who think that they "should be" in power yoga, when they really need to be in a beginner's class or something similar. in the studio where i level out (mentioned around here some where), most people sign up for level 2 who have no business signing up for anything other than therapeutics.
so, i find that the labeling of my classes is often ridiculous from this stand point, but it's also difficult based on what i do.
when i teach, it's always leveled and taught to the people present. if an arthritic elder comes to class, then we're going to do postures in ways that suit her, and will also keep the class engaged. my experienced students never, ever have a problem with it, the beginners 'go with the flow' of it, and the newbie has a great time.
the next class might be all my experienced people, and we'll rock out on some crazy-advanced moves. anyone looking in on us would say "that class is impossible!" which of course, it may be for them right then, and of course when they come to class, it wouldn't be that way because they're in it!
so, how do i label my classes? i tend to use "all levels yoga" as a general catch all, so that everyone feels welcome. but i do have people who go online and look up 'types of yoga' and they 'll ask me "is your yoga like power yoga? classical yoga? iyengar yoga?" and i tell them that it's free form vinyasa, like power yoga, but that it's always leveled to the people in the room--there are no set sequencing, everything has multiple levels of modification which i will instruct each student in specificly, that i give adjustments, etc.
but honestly, in many cases, we just call it "yoga" and then the description is: this class is all levels! come with an open mind to open your body in new and dynamic ways using the ancient technique of yoga!
blah-dee-blah. most people don't know what they're in for anyway, even if they do read descriptions.
usually, i have no clue what a class is going to be like. i just keep an open mind and go. (and, i have this funny/nasty habit of always taking a beginners course at any new studio that i go to so that i can learn the 'style' and 'alignment' from the ground up. my local iyengar teacher immediately advanced me to level 4 after the first class. i wanted to take level 1 for those 10 weeks--but she wouldn't allow it. nope! level 4! had to change the day and everything, but then she changed her schedule and it didn't match anymore and i had to stop going!). | |
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question for the group?