YOGA ALLIANCE NO THIS IS YOGA MAFIA IS JUST NAME TO MAKE MONEY?
Posted 2010-01-20 12:02 AM (#120838) Subject: YOGA ALLIANCE NO THIS IS YOGA MAFIA IS JUST NAME TO MAKE MONEY?
hey,,friends,,there are the teachers who dont know anything and ,,i have seen they are also taking this ya status.i also approach them,,and they said you have to give this much of money and you have to send certificate ,,ok thats enough,,these american fellows really know how to make money,,there are many reputed yoga centres in india,,no body got this idea ,,that how to make easy money,,hmmm,,,but now they have set there name so big,,and a teacher have to pay to a huge money to register,,,it can be cheap for american teachers but not for asian country teacher,,,,,,,,what is this f,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,, YA,,,,,,,,,JUST TO MAKE MONEY.I HAVE QUESTION ,WHERE IS ALL MONEY GOING,WHAT THEY ARE MAKING FROM ALL OVER THE WORLD,ARE THEY SERVING YOGA ,,KNOW,,JUST SERVING THEIR OWN POCKETS,,,,DO SOME GOOD WORK MANS,,SERVE THE SOCIETY SERVE YOGA,,NOW YOU GUYS HAVE MAKE YOUR NAME LIKE THIS ,,THAT IF A TEACHER OR COURSE NOT REGISTERED WITH YOU,,PEOPLE ARE THINKING TO TAKE OR NOT,,EVEN IT IS BETTER THAN YOUR REGISTERD SCHOOL. WHAT A STATEGY,CUNNING MIND IS WORKING BEHIND ,,THIS ,AND A TEACHER FROM INDIA WHO HAVE NOT THIS BIG MONEY TO PAY,,EVEN HE IS GRADUATED (ONE YEAR DEGREE 2600 HOUR) IN YOGA HAS NO VALUE COMPARE THAT A TEACHER WHO HAS TAKEN JUST 200 HOUR COURSE AND JUST REGISTER WITH YOGA ALLIANCE ,,WHAT REGISTERD ,,JUST PAY A SUM OF MONEY TO THEM........AND YOU ARE GOOD,,THEY DONT HAVE ANY PRACTICAL APPROACH TOWARDS YOGA ,,JUST MONEY ,,MONEY AND MONEY ,,LIKE YOGA MAFIA
Posted 2010-01-20 8:02 AM (#120851 - in reply to #120838) Subject: Re: YOGA ALLIANCE NO THIS IS YOGA MAFIA IS JUST NAME TO MAKE MONEY?
Hi Cool Yogi, well I can't really speak to some of your points, here is what I do know. In the US, there are many states that are requiring that yoga teachers are licensed or certified before they teach. Lots of good reasons for this and lots of good reasons against this. But regardless of where one stands on the issue, the facts remain that anyone can call themselves a yoga teacher and no one really knows if they are qualified or not. However, the difficulty with "certification systems" as you point out is that just because I have been through training doesn't mean that I am any good.....but on average, people who have been through a certified YTT know more about yoga and teaching yoga than they did before they started. Clearly if someone's been living yoga for years but has not taken formal, accredited training, they know more than someone who's only gone through a 200 hour program, but the problem with setting arbitrary guidelines is that they are arbitrary!
also people don't pay lots of money to YA for their certification, that's relatively cheap, but YTT Programs can be very expensive! So I don't see Yoga Alliance as the Yoga Mafia, but I do think that the fees that some of the commercial programs charge are usurious.
Posted 2010-01-20 8:23 AM (#120853 - in reply to #120838) Subject: Re: YOGA ALLIANCE NO THIS IS YOGA MAFIA IS JUST NAME TO MAKE MONEY?
Well stated Sharon!
Posted 2010-01-20 10:35 AM (#120858 - in reply to #120853) Subject: Re: YOGA ALLIANCE NO THIS IS YOGA MAFIA IS JUST NAME TO MAKE MONEY?
the purpose of YA is to be a lobbying organization to help prevent the regulation (licensing, etc) of yoga in the US. In order to prevent this (licensing, etc), a voluntary registry is set up to demonstrate that the community is self-regulating and therefore doesn't require government regulation.
while registry is relatively inexpensive as compared to the cost of training (and the required continuing education), it is a carrying cost for teachers and the only benefit that it provides is whatever benefit the registry itself provides against government regulation.
it is debatable whether or not YA does any active lobbying or if there is any to be done, or one which fronts YA is particularly working. personally, i haven't seen reports of this in their own materials, as they now seem to focus on registering schools.
what is increasingly frustrating about YA for me is that they have now gained recognition such that if one is *not* registered then they are seen as lesser. in the early days of YA, it was simply a voluntary registry where no one was "lesser or greater" so long as they met or exceeded the basic requirements.
now, i notice, that a lot of "buyers" of teacher trainnings and teachers want the YA "seal of approval" on their trainnings and teachers--even though, imo, the standards are actually quite low, the prices to maintain registry are quite high, and the benefits (lobbying/etc) are not obvious.
what gets even more challenging regarding YA for me is the fact that they have an international registry now. they have no influence or impact on foreign governments, and what happens in the states in regards to licensing has no impact on thos teachers. the primary purpose of the registry, therefore, shifts from being an important anti-regulation organization to simply a "seal of approval" organization, and the cost is significantly more and must be maintained each year.
for my own experience on YA, i registered with them in my early days of full time teaching--in 2002. I registered as a 500 hr RYT. my reasoning for this was because my teacher training experience was an apprenticeship without any sort of "certificate" to demonstrate certification or that i'd completed anything. with this, my primary teacher and i were on the verge of a huge falling out, and my past experience between him and other students in similar situations demonstrated that he fully denounced even training them and thus many were unable to verify that they were "certified" by him or even had trained with him.
in order to avoid this, when i began to see the earliest forms of us entering that particular dance, i filled out the YA paperwork, wrote a letter on my teacher's behalf which he signed, and then received my registry about 1 week before our break. so, while i would claim my teacher training to potential employers, it was my YA registry that verified that i had met the basic requirements of 500 hrs of training.
i maintained my membership until 2006 or 7. by this time, i had a strong enough reputation in our community that i was often turning jobs down and the expense of maintaining the membership was too great for me. it was literally a choice between YA or more training, and i chose more training. likewise, i didn't notice that YA was giving me any more benefit than i'd already had.
by this time, i was also training teachers. many of the schools here are registered with YA and are terrible--and have terrible reputations. students came to me and were certified in their own time--apprenticeship style. in this community, if you say "i was trained by zoebird." people know the quality of your training. often, employers will call me for information, references, my training, etc, and i'm happy to answer.
but things are changing again.
i am moving from the US to New Zealand. many of my teachers who are certified by me now want to register with YA in order to verify their training to future employers who do not want to call a teacher in NZ to verify the training of their potential employee.
in order to register, i have to fill out all the YA paperwork, and then they have to fill out the paperwork and pay a fee. a non-registered equivalent to the E-RYT (those who are verified to train teachers) have to fill this out for *every* graduate registering. obviously, this is cost-prohibitive as time is money and the forms take quite a bit of effort to fill out (even if i keep a copy and simply print it out, it needs to be updated each time, etc).
in NZ, americans have moved in and started putting forth the value of YA. . . even though they have no presence in NZ or impact on the legal situation or anything else in that aspect of what YA is about. . .and so students there see it as a valuable aspect to verify their training.
i figured i would continue as i have here--just filling out the paperwork as needed--but that has currently demonstrated itself to be rather difficult. LOL i keep having to update and print out the same things many times over for each student. so, i'm going to re-instate my RYT and then upgrade to the E-RYT. That will cost me $55 and $95 respectively.
Since i plan on running my teacher trainings in NZ, i also considered registering the schools so that students would simply have to check one box if they decided to register. But, that is cost prohibitive with no benefit except "verification."
But, by reinstating and getting my E-RYT, the students can fill out the paperwork themselves (i'll provide a break down of the hours and such for them), and they can just check a box that i'm an E-RYT (saves me time), and so it just makes it easier.
but registering the courses is very expensive and, imo, needless. i just don't want to do that due to the expense. it's like $250 per year for a school that's international, and it's no express benefit other than the verification and making paperwork easier. that's too high a price for me.
Posted 2010-01-20 11:58 AM (#120860 - in reply to #120838) Subject: Re: YOGA ALLIANCE NO THIS IS YOGA MAFIA IS JUST NAME TO MAKE MONEY?
Very well said ZB!
Posted 2010-01-20 1:19 PM (#120863 - in reply to #120838) Subject: Re: YOGA ALLIANCE NO THIS IS YOGA MAFIA IS JUST NAME TO MAKE MONEY?
I'm uncertain which characteristics of "mafia" the Yoga Alliance has mimicked.
At best, with the shards of concept put forward in the OP, one could make the case that the Alliance is overly capitalistic, poorly run, lacking ethics, or without a mission. And frankly I don't know the organization to such a depth that I could say any of those with conviction.
A yoga teacher can elect to register with YA or not. Hopefully in the process of yoga we learn to take full responsibility for our living. If one does not like the paradigm of teaching in India one may leave. If one does not like the Yoga Alliance one may avoid paying them anything at all. If one finds the parameters of teaching yoga here or there - or the lack of parameters - to be distasteful then one can teach something else or nothing at all.
Registries and certifications are just one of a myriad of credentials. By themselves they mean very little. Combined with what is behind them and with other such credentials they mean something - but not everything.
The state of yoga here in the U.S. is a bit distressing. One can call themselves a yoga teacher after a "long weekend" of training. So for me I'd rather there be a yoga alliance than not. At the same time I realize that a teacher who has a 500-hour YA registration may or may not be a "good" teacher.
Posted 2010-01-22 9:59 PM (#120932 - in reply to #120838) Subject: Re: YOGA ALLIANCE NO THIS IS YOGA MAFIA IS JUST NAME TO MAKE MONEY?
Great info Zoe Bird!! I truly did not know all of that. I did my YA training simply because no reputable studio or even a decent gym in my area would hire me without it. Plain and Simple. However, I did learn a lot in my training and met a group of amazing women that I will never forget. Yoga Alliance registration is not expensive at all. It is the actual teacher training that is expensive.
As Gordan alluded to, the YA is terribly unorganized and,in my own words, "ghetto". Whenever I have to contact them, I know not to hold my breath or I would surely be dead before I heard back.
Posted 2010-01-27 7:28 PM (#121035 - in reply to #120838) Subject: Re: YOGA ALLIANCE NO THIS IS YOGA MAFIA IS JUST NAME TO MAKE MONEY?
It's a waste of money and time. They got together to stop the government and know the government is using the registry to hunt down studios to pay licencing fees in some states. New York is having hell of battle against regulation right now. I say don't join, you get no benefits at all.
Posted 2010-12-27 5:15 AM (#126626 - in reply to #126588) Subject: Re: YOGA ALLIANCE NO THIS IS YOGA MAFIA IS JUST NAME TO MAKE MONEY?
since this one got resurrected, i thought i would chime in again.
foremost, it might also be noted that in many countries around the world YA registered school graduation is necesary to get the proper insurance. so, it has become a regulatory body in that way, though in my opinion, a right flawed one.
but, not to get into the flaws, it is expensive for me to maintain registry for myself and for my school on an annual basis for pretty much very little return.
in order for me to run the school, i need to renew with upgrade at the international rate: $145. then, i need to register my school as an international school: $700.
and of course, here is a kicker. if they don't accept my school the first time (which my friends tell me is actually pretty common, even though the schools *exceed* ya standards before applying), you don't get to do so for free, you get to pay $700 again! whoopie!
then, each year after that, i have to pay to renew myself at $145 and then renew my school at $400 each year. Somehow, that's not considered expensive?
perhaps you are not running a *business* with the teaching of the yoga. because i am running a business. And that means every expense needs to have some *return on investment* of some sort. And YA gives me. . .big fat zero.
as i wrote before, they have no impact on regulation of yoga ANYWHERE except in the US, and there, it may or may not be successful. So, where is all of the money going from these registered people and registered schools? Administration? overhead? because i don't see them hiring a ton of lobbyists. that's just me, though, i mean, i'm begging the question. What are they doing with that money?
I could see if YA registry gave me access to goods and services like it used to -- such as group insurance plans for liability insurance. But a friend of mine mentioned -- what about group health and dental insurance plans, or the option for group retirement/investment funds? Nope, they aren't interested in that.
And what about due process? if there is a problem with a registered person or school -- be it ethical or some other issue --how would they be "unregistered?" that is to say, lets say that one school makes orgies mandatory as part of their education and we feel that is, in general, repugnant (i'm not saying i do, i'm just offering it up). how would that school be registered or not registered once a complaint against them is made?
what about yogalady there, whose experience i also share? i recently hired a teacher who couldn't teach her way out of a paper bag, and yet she went to a registered school. if we call YA and "report" the school, what happens? There's no quality assurance involved, simply the taking of money and the offering of a brand. that's really *all* it is.
i'm still saying no thanks, and looking to get my program reviewed by the New Zealand Quality Assurance. They review all sorts of things, including the technical colleges such as the massage schools and so on in NZ. I based a lot of my program design on the local massage schools (for massage) and technical colleges (for yoga), and gave it my own flavor. I have a meeting with NZQA in the new year to align my program to their standards. The fee is low, and there is an on-going process. They review you after 3 years, and then after that review, every 5 years -- unless a complaint is made against you, at which point, you go "under review" right away, and there is a due process to determine whether or not you meet the standards or had a breach, and what you can do to fix it (without added fees), or if everything is A-ok and the complaint was false or what have you.
it's a much better strategy for me, because it has that process of review. you meet the standards, then they review you, and review you again and again to make sure you meet those standards. and it's not just paperwork. you do that, but they also observe classes, overview final examinations, etc. it's a bit more involved than a simple money in- brand out.
Posted 2011-06-16 12:40 AM (#208677 - in reply to #120838) Subject: Re: YOGA ALLIANCE NO THIS IS YOGA MAFIA IS JUST NAME TO MAKE MONEY?
I totally agree that Yoga Alliance is like the mafia: they offer protection in return for money!
No integrity, no accountability, there is nothing ethical about their business.
I was cheated out of HK$ 20,000 by a Hong Kong school that offered a teacher training programme recognized by YA. The standards were appalling, and 6 months into my programme the school was shut down by court orders because the school director siphoned off all the money instead of paying her debts. I was left high and dry, no school, no certificate, no apologies, nothing. So i approached YA, and their reply was: "it's a private matter between you and school, we can't interfere."
The school conned about 100 teacher trainees, and YA didn't even suspend the director's license...as a matter of fact this lady opened another school, and is conning more people. What is YA doing? Nothing. They seem happy to get their yearly membership fee from this thief!