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Expert Yogi
Posts: 1738
   
Location: right where I'm supposed to be | Cyndi, everyone has their own style. It's like painting. you put a vase with flowers on a table and ask everyone to paint a still life, each painting has it's own dimensions as seen through the eyes of each artist. That is not hard to comprehend.
I think we all have the same goals but go about presenting it differently. Some dive right in and some progress slow, depending on the circumstances.
Yeah Cyndi, we're all just making it up! That's a ignorant statement!
Mish
Edited by mishoga 2006-03-29 6:17 PM
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Expert Yogi
Posts: 8442
 
| Again with the emotionally charged words - eeeesh! I want to back to work to my sweet little one year olds.... 
In a way (and I love the painting analogy BTW) we ARE each making it up as we go along. Unless we are teaching completely from a script (and even then the delivery of the words would differ and the response from the students would reflect that) we will teach essentially the same things differently. And thank goodness for that. I might hear an instruction 25 times from teacher A and not understand it fully, but when I hear teacher B with her own unique slant - *bingo*! everything falls into place.  |
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Extreme Veteran
Posts: 418
Location: New York | Cyndi - 2006-03-29 5:29 PM
mishoga - 2006-03-29 4:38 PM
Zoe, this makes a lot of sense and I completely agree with you. I feel the same way. Some of us just go about presenting it in a different way. Well, we all present it differently.
This is where I get really confused. How can you present Yoga a different way?? Do you mind sharing some examples of what is so different in the way you present yoga than it already is or has been for all these thousands of years?? Do you present it from the foundation of Yoga?? Or have you just made it up along the way?? I can see where making it up along the way could be treading on an area I'm not real comfortable with, but I'll wait till you answer before I make that decision. I'm just curious about this.
Yoga is presented in different ways by yoga masters, or those who are widely considered to be gurus. For instance, Pattahbi Jois and BKS Iyengar present yoga in vastly different ways. So I don't see why it's so shocking for Mish to suggest that as teachers, or instructors, that we present, or instruct, in different ways. |
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| The greatest teachers always begin by proclaming their ignorance. We are all making it up as we go along, some of us just have the guts to admit it. The people who really scare me are the ones who think they have all the answers, they're the fanatics who would bind us in the darkness. Only those who the courage to live in the uncertainty of ignorance have the ability to change things for the better. We as human beings learn by falling down again and again and again and again. Each time we pick ourselves up, and move on, a little better than the last time. |
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Expert Yogi
Posts: 1738
Location: right where I'm supposed to be | GJ, By far, I have much to learn. I don't have all the answers. I'm not claiming to know it all, never have. But that statement....come on, we all know the meaning implied.
I learn so much from all of you but I will admit, when someone makes a statement as such, I shut down. Every other word typed gets fuzzy after that.
Mish
Edited by mishoga 2006-03-30 6:16 AM
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| i really love the swami vivekananda quote you have there mish. i think it's really important.
i know that i have my own way of teaching that's different from other teachers. And i also know that it's not the only way, the one true way, or whatever else. i teach differently from how my teacher's teach, and they're supportive of that because they believe in finding your own voice and sharing from your own experiences. i think that this is really valuable.
i think that it is really difficult to deviate from the core or heart of yoga. at it's very heart, it's about union with the divine. whether we know it or understand it or not, we're always in a state of union with the divine, as the divine lives through us. through yoga practice, we begin to understand this more deeply and more clearly.
i think that for many people, the first step is doing what kym talked about--opening communication between the body-mind. many people are disconnected here, and because of that, they are also disconnected from their own spirits and often choose against themselves because of their egos, fears, life traumas or wahtever else. i do it--i have seen many others do it as well. it's part of being human, i think. by becoming more connected between body-mind, we also become more connected to our spirit-selves, that which is Divine within. And, we begin to see this in others, and we see ourselves in that, our unity with each other, and our commonalities rather than our differences. But, seeing our differences is also important, as the divine is wild and free, and differences and paradoxes have their beautiful place in the universe as well and we can learn from that.
because of my perspective of yoga asana being part of a larger system, and that there's really ultimately no way to divorce it from the larger process (it's a spiritual discipline that leads to union with the divine), even teachers who are ignorant of this process or who do not focus or consider this process important or an aspect that they want to teach are still reaching to and teaching to this other aspect.
in this way, i think it's pretty much impossible for someone to harm yoga no matter how they're teaching it. ultimately, the yoga itself wins out, and the student will recieve the benefit of the practice in the ways that they need to most. Each teacher has something to offer that will reach the needs of his/her students, and when that need is met, and the teacher cannot meet the newly-developed needs, the student will find the next teacher. This is part of the process of personal, spiritual development as well.
my concern regarding many asana teachers--regardless of where they get their training--is that they are not experienced enough in asana or have enough teacher training to keep students physically safe. along with this, many do not have the basics of psychological understanding, as well as psychology of spirituality to keep their students safe in the classroom when things arise within the student, or between the student and teacher. this is why there are often ethics standards and certain rules for teachers, to protect both teachers and students from these psychological arises for which many teachers are not prepared, but even so they have a policy on which they can rely. those who don't are treading in dangerous waters (particularly with the process of transference)--for themselves and for their students. But, even this yoga will overcome with time, and karmicly speaking, it is part of the process of both teacher and student growth. |
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Expert Yogi
Posts: 1738
Location: right where I'm supposed to be | Oh how I wish I could take one of your classes Zoe. You type what is in my heart.
I am not a Asana only teacher. Not that it makes me different from an asana teacher. I think we all are one on the same path with the same goals. We are penny givers. We add richness to others lives and enjoy doing so. I didn't choose this path, it choose me (OK, I am a crappy speller). I am thankful all the time for being able, capable, and willing to give of myself.
When someone instructs with this true love, it shines. You can't help but feel it. You can tell whether a person decides to instruct yoga for a vocation or from the heart. Ane when it comes from the heart it's beautiful.
There has to be a starting point. Eventually it will lead to more intense study, devotion, dedication, etc...
This is how I feel. It doesn't mean I am right or wrong. It just IS! No one is right or wrong. We just ARE! When we can respect one another for our individual beliefs, virtues, and morals....to me that is the ultimate place to start and move forward with a compassionate heart.
I am not a forceful person. For me, and for my students, an open and accepting heart is the way to go. It has opened the connection to expand on yoga asana and lifestyle. I introduce more as I see the acceptance level increase. When they are ready for more I can feel it.
Mishy |
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Expert Yogi
Posts: 8442
| Nice posts ladies  Here is a little that I read from Light on Life to my classes last night:
"Very few people begin yoga because they believe it will be a way to achieve spiritual enlightenment, and indeed a good number may be quite sceptical about the whole idea of spiritual self-realization. Actually, this is not a bad thing because it means most people who come to yoga are practical peole who have practical problems and aims - people who are grounded in the ways and means of life, people who are sensible." |
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| mishoga - 2006-03-30 6:15 AM
GJ, By far, I have much to learn. I don't have all the answers. I'm not claiming to know it all, never have. But that statement....come on, we all know the meaning implied.
Yup, it's getting ugly in here again. |
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Expert Yogi
Posts: 8442
| GreenJello - 2006-03-30 7:22 AM
Yup, it's getting ugly in here again.
No, no, no! Yoga is about sweetness and light, incense and flowers, little fountains that play music and hugs all around all the time. There is NO ugly in yoga  And if you believe that you have never seen my attempts at padmasana or the sorry state of our mat storage cupboard some days  |
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| oh my goodness, i could tell you horror stories about prop storage! at the Y, a client and i clean the storage room up every week! we even labelled where things go, and people leave it a mess (it's also used for pilates and aerobics). we even put up a note to ask people to please put things away neatly. Each week, sometimes twice a week, we have to clean up the whole closet!
sometimes, yoga is very messy.  |
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| tourist - 2006-03-30 10:49 AM
GreenJello - 2006-03-30 7:22 AM
Yup, it's getting ugly in here again.
No, no, no! Yoga is about sweetness and light, incense and flowers, little fountains that play music and hugs all around all the time.
Woot! I wanna convert to Iyengar, this ashtanga stuff is hard work, the fountains don't work, the incense makes me sneeze, the flowers give me hives, and some of the people are down right unpleasant. |
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Location: Upstate NY | GreenJello - 2006-03-29 9:56 AM
Interesting link, though a bit preachy. Here's a good example:
4. PROPER DIET (Vegetarian)
Besides being responsible for building our physical body, the foods we eat profoundly affect our mind. For maximum body-mind efficiency and complete spiritual awareness, Yoga advocates a lacto-vegetarian diet. This is an integral part of the Yogic lifestyle.
The last sentence really bothers me. Eating right is definitely part of the Yogic lifestyle, vegan or vegitarianism is not necessarily so. - it would be if you took in part ahimsa and vegetarianism which I know we have beat to death on other threads before. IMHO this statement is very true if one is in total practice of Ahimsa, but this is my opinion only which also happens to be the opinion of many great yogis......... |
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| There's a number of subtle problems with statements on the site. I think somebody mentioned the lacto part of their statement, there's a few others I haven't mentioned.
You are correct we've beat the vegitarianism thing to death, so I won't start.
Edited by GreenJello 2006-03-31 10:49 AM
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Expert Yogi
Posts: 8442
| I'll start! I'm home sick with a sinus infection and no voice so I'm cranky and looking for something to b*tch about Show me a person who practices "total" ahimsa and I'll show you a person who is dead. Total ahimsa is not possible for a living human being. There - go for it! |
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| tourist - 2006-03-31 10:55 AM
I'll start! I'm home sick with a sinus infection and no voice so I'm cranky and looking for something to b*tch about Show me a person who practices "total" ahimsa and I'll show you a person who is dead. Total ahimsa is not possible for a living human being. There - go for it!
Glenda's on a rant! FWIW, I think the operative term is "NON" in the non-violence. |
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| I believe that many people consider Gandhi and/or Mother Theresa to be the modern personifications of ahimsa in action. Granted, they're both dead, but it's all I got for you today! |
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Expert Yogi
Posts: 8442
| Well, they did better than most of us, I am sure But I bet their simple cotton garments were produced at the cost of some poor sad cotton wevils and they inadvertently harmed because there is no way to prevent that. I mean, MT was Catholic for goodness sake! We could go on for years about the abuses of the church. So my beef is with the word "total" more than anything... |
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| Even the grass doesn't want to be walked on. |
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| time to call the Jains in on this one... |
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| T - Show me a person who practices "total" ahimsa and I'll show you a person who is dead. Total ahimsa is not possible for a living human being. There - go for it!
The hardest thing that we, as human beings, are the revelations of our limitations. Total ahimsa doesn’t make you dead, only the possibility of trying to practice it might make you feel so.
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Location: Upstate NY | I think that is where so many get confused, to "practice" ahimsa or to live in total ahimsa. I can consciously practice non-violence and for the days that I may mistakenly step on the bug or one hits my windshield, does not mean I cannot pray for them. One can tread lightly in this world and live in peace and see the Presence of God in all from Man to Mineral.
What I get from all of the we can't live in ahimsa bugaroo is the same from people who smoke and say "hey, I'm gonna die someday anyway". Granted the statement is true, but there are sure better ways to die then of lung cancer. Same theory holds true for Ahimsa.
Om Shanti,
Ravi |
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