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Expert Yogi
Posts: 2479
  
Location: A Blue State |
So I'm really puzzled by the slavish and unthoughtful teaching methods recently coming out of Mysore -- why has everything gotten to be sooooo rote, and soooo inflexible, and soooo pro forma? Wasn't that way 20 years ago...
Any thoughts on this?
.... bg |
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Location: London, England | Bay Guy - 2011-09-21 1:42 AM
So I'm really puzzled by the slavish and unthoughtful teaching methods recently coming out of Mysore -- why has everything gotten to be sooooo rote, and soooo inflexible, and soooo pro forma? Wasn't that way 20 years ago...
Any thoughts on this?
.... bg
Hi BG,
I'm a bit out of touch-what's been going on with the Mysore method? To me, Astanga yoga has often seemed like some of the things you said-six series, no progressing beyond a posture that you can't 'do' yet, counting breaths...depends on the teacher, of course. Maybe you were just lucky 20 years ago to train with someone who struck all the right chords?
Nick |
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Location: London, England | double post 
Edited by Nick 2011-09-21 7:58 AM
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Expert Yogi
Posts: 2479
Location: A Blue State |
Hi Nick,
Well, what I mean is that, according to people who worked with Jois directly and early on, his teaching was tailored around individual students. It was not, as some of today's younger teacher present it, as if things were either right or were wrong. Perhaps my initial comments could be better phrased to say that today's teachers seem to be more rigid about what they will allow, if only from the insecurity that comes with relative inexperience, or because of a focus on climbing the certification ladder.
RE your other comment, sequences to be done sequentially, counting breaths, dristi, etc. are of course integral to the Ashtanga style.
... bg |
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Location: London, England | Hi BG,
I never heard of Jois doing that-might be my memory . I guess there would be a multitude of reasons, bit like all the Iyengar books where they all copy his gruff face
Nick |
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Member
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Location: Uppsala, Sweden | Hi,
I am new here, hence the late reply. To get tailored teaching, the teacher must also have a chance to really get to know the student, I think. I am not a teacher, only a rather inept student. When I started practicing yoga, my teacher would often show what might be considered inflexibility, repeting the same instructions over and over. As I now have practiced at the same shala for over two years, she is being much more personal in her instructions to me. She knows my weaknesses, when she needs to help me and when she can leave me alone. But it is a two-way street. I would not progress if I didn't make an effort to really listen to instructions, to communicate. Working together this way is possible only because I have been staying with the same teacher for a longer time period, at least that is the way I see it. As ashtanga yoga shalas are popping up everywhere and more and more people start practicing, maybe what you have experienced is just reflecting that there are a lot of beginners around...?
You didn't say anything about your level of experience in your first post (and I don't know you), so it's hard to know if you are talking about teacher attitudes towards you or towards other students or in what way you have encountered this situation. Anyway, those are my thoughts.
Edited by nordiclights 2011-11-01 5:37 PM
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Extreme Veteran
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| Funny as its not just out of Mysore. Ive seen lots of strange 'Yoga' all over the world. However I have also seen styles of yoga that are far superior to traditional ancient teachings. Guess times are just changing. |
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Expert Yogi
Posts: 2479
Location: A Blue State |
Ohhhh... okay... so I am talking about what people who learned directly from Jois in the 1970's and 1980's say about his teaching in comparison to what one gets in some venues in the US. The old guard are pretty clear in describing a transition toward rigidity among some teachers [in the US, I will add] who have mainly learned since 2000 or so.
RE myself, I've practiced for some time, across many styles of yoga, and with a number of extremely well experienced teachers. I don't particularly listen when the younger ones tell me "it's only this way" or "it's never that way". I've had Certified Ashtanga teachers tell me directly to question statements like that. So, back to my original comment -- what's wrong with the current class of teachers? [Reminds me of the bullsh!t we discussed at length in the Bikram forum 5+ years ago.] But I'll also acknowledge that I have Iyengar roots and believe very strongly that yoga must be adapted by individuals to their own abilities, in consultation with a teacher of course.
PS to our friend in Sweden -- there's at least one impressive Ashtanga teacher over there -- I've seen her YouTube videos.
... bg |
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Location: London, England | Hi Bay Guy,
Back when I started teaching, you did it because you loved it-and because you loved it, you had gone to loads of classes, maybe with lots of different teachers-kind of anarchic learning-nowadays, people do one very expensive teacher training course, maybe a bit more, and that's it-no opportunity to discuss or get other student's or teachers point of view.
It all seemed to really change in the mid 90's, after which we got a huge influx of teachers who are almost all completely useless-in it for money and a chance to massage their fragile egos. Loads of mums started teaching as a way of having a part-time job. Then loads of ex-dancers and personal trainers joined in.None of these people seem to have a clue.
Nick |
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Expert Yogi
Posts: 2479
Location: A Blue State | Hi Nick -- You've summed up my feelings as well!
Cheers,
...bg |
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Expert Yogi
Posts: 2479
Location: A Blue State | http://www.xtranormal.com/watch/12649218/the-ashtanga-police
Here's another take on this issue.
Enjoy!
..bg |
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Location: London, England | Hey BG that was hilarious-will have to look in to who did the script. I think that all forms of yoga suffer from this dogma, but for various reasons it is possible in the modern age to recognise when something is suspect-for some, at least-not for enough though
Personally, I think that all forms of yoga need a kick up the jacksie, as we used to say here, I teach yoga because I think it can be a great tool, but only if we let go of the mistakes that were made in the past.
Nick |
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Expert Yogi
Posts: 2479
Location: A Blue State |
Incorrect method! No benefit!
.. bg |
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Extreme Veteran
Posts: 574
| Incorrect will give more benefits than correct. Correct also means correct according to one or certain schools of thought. Then a better technique can turn up and we dismiss it as being incorrect. Many years ago many thought the Earth was square, anyone who disagreed was incorrect. Yoga benefits us more when we can be flexible in our thinking (after all, our flexibility is from the brain-body harmony). |
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| Nick - 2011-11-28 5:52 PM
I teach yoga because I think it can be a great tool, but only if we let go of the mistakes that were made in the past.
Nick
Unfortunately, many of these mistakes from the past are now considered sacred in the present!
The more different perspectives that you get about a single thing, the more understanding you get of that thing. A single perspective gives a distorted view.
I also teach yoga because it is a great tool; for health and happiness. You don't need authority figures, sacred books, magical mumbo-jumbo, dogma, magic words or any of that to get the actual benefits of yoga. All you need is to get out your mat and practice, paying attention while doing so. The rest is simply childish nonsense, although it pays really well if you can convince others that you are a "master" of that nonsense.
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Location: London, England | Hi Jim,
Yep, it's the sacredness which is so difficult to get past-people look at you like you are committing blasphemy if you challenge commonly held yoga 'truths.' Even things like should the feet be touching each other in tadasana-dogma often wins, because a lot of yoga teachers fulfil their student's expectations about what is spiritual by repeating the dogma of the past-very frustrating
Nick |
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| Hi Nick,
To me, one of the great things about practicing yoga is self discovery. You mentioned Tadasana and whether the feet should be together or not. If you try both and evaluate exactly what the differences are, you will discover things about yourself (body and mind). If you follow dogma (even your own from yesterday) you will no longer discover anything, you will just go through the motions. As Nietzsche put it, you only start to find truth when you see something from every possible perspective. It is too bad that dogma and the presumptive authority of tradition so often trump logic, verifiable evidence and open minded discovery. I think that it probably has something to do with people's uneasiness with uncertainty.
Jim
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Expert Yogi
Posts: 2479
Location: A Blue State | And self discovery is a daily process. There's something different about my body or mind every time I'm on the mat. it may just be that I'm more tired or more energetic on most days, but on some it's a realization that some part of me has not been awake in my previous practices.... e.g., I've recently discovered that I was not thinking about some powerful muscles in my back while doing Viparita Chakrasana -- putting it all in the hips instead. Yoga is constant self discovery.
... bg
Edited by Bay Guy 2012-02-01 10:39 PM
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Current teachings -- are they insane?
