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| I haven't been practicing for a long time - maybe a few months consistently, but I already feel this immense desire to never set foot in a gym again. Has anyone else exprerienced this? It's a very strange feeling because I've lifted weights seriously for almost 10 years (always trying to be that girl who could outlift the guys in the gym).  But now, I don't crave it. Every now and then I feel like doing pull-ups, or some other functional movement, but other than that...nada.
Does a regular ashtanga practice (6xweek) provide enough weight-bearing exercise? Although I first and foremost enjoy the meditative benefits, I do know that lifting weights is good for bone density and want to maintain that aspect of my health. I still run 3-4xweek simply because I enjoy it.
Any wisdom/thoughts/advice (not that the three are mutually exclusive) would be greatly appreciated! Thank you! |
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| Yes---as someone who used to lift seriously, and then three years ago transitioned soley to ashtanga- I can attest that it's plently alone.
No need to lift unless you absolutely crave it---and even then, use caution about overtraining.
After three and a half years of ashtanga my body is far more muscular and defined than it ever was from the gym- if thats a concern.
Many articles (ie in yoga journal and such) do attest to the bone building capacity of yoga.
Do what you love.  |
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| I'll second Chutarunga. I'm a life-long runner and free weighter and have stopped that for the last 8 months and "converted" to yoga (Bikram and Power at this point). I wrote elsewhere in this forum that if I aspired to be an "Arnold" type specimen, yoga would not be the route I'd take but truely believe that I'm stronger from yoga than other forms of fitness in that I can use the strength and flexibility consistently as I lack the soreness and injury from running and weights.
amechan - 2004-04-23 8:51 AM
I haven't been practicing for a long time - maybe a few months consistently, but I already feel this immense desire to never set foot in a gym again. Has anyone else exprerienced this? It's a very strange feeling because I've lifted weights seriously for almost 10 years (always trying to be that girl who could outlift the guys in the gym ). But now, I don't crave it. Every now and then I feel like doing pull-ups, or some other functional movement, but other than that...nada.
Does a regular ashtanga practice (6xweek ) provide enough weight-bearing exercise? Although I first and foremost enjoy the meditative benefits, I do know that lifting weights is good for bone density and want to maintain that aspect of my health. I still run 3-4xweek simply because I enjoy it.
Any wisdom/thoughts/advice (not that the three are mutually exclusive ) would be greatly appreciated! Thank you! |
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| Thanks, Chutarunga and Bruce! Actually, it'd be nice to lose some of the muscle I've gained over the years. (Well, maybe it's not ALL muscle, if you know what I mean.) I also started to notice how one day of lifting would affect a day or two of practice. And it upset me more to have a less than optimal practice than to drop lifting altogether. Mostly I was worried about maintaining my bone density. I'll try to look up articles in Yoga Journal. Anyway, it's comforting to know this is normal. And honestly...I don't know if I'd have the energy to haul iron anymore.
Edited by amechan 2004-04-23 3:18 PM
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| I dunno kiddo--there seems to be a plethora of information regarding maintaining bone density. I probably should care but don't -- I figure if I'm doing anykind of physical activity I'm doing what I should be doing. And I really believe that 90 minutes of fighting gravity and my own stiffness in a yoga class is better for me than injuring stuff running or lifting.
amechan - 2004-04-23 2:17 PM
Thanks, Chutarunga and Bruce! Actually, it'd be nice to lose some of the muscle I've gained over the years. (Well, maybe it's not ALL muscle, if you know what I mean. ) I also started to notice how one day of lifting would affect a day or two of practice. And it upset me more to have a less than optimal practice than to drop lifting altogether. Mostly I was worried about maintaining my bone density. I'll try to look up articles in Yoga Journal. Anyway, it's comforting to know this is normal. And honestly...I don't know if I'd have the energy to haul iron anymore. |
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| Ah well - I think bone-density is usually something females concern themselves with. A lot of it is probably the culture I grew up with as well (Japan - big focus on fish fish fish for good bones and health!). But I like your "go with the flow" mentality, Bruce - do what works for you! I know running is probably not the greatest thing for my knees at times, or my hips, but on a nice day, it's almost a meditative experience for me. So I enjoy it. Maybe when my practice becomes more advanced, I'll find myself enlightened and realize yoga is all I need. |
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| Jogging was a form of relaxation for me too. Early in the A.M., quiet, still--I often felt I was the king of the world when I'd come to stop lights flashing red as they hadn't changed to accodate rush hour....hell, I'm going jogging tomorrow
amechan - 2004-04-23 6:55 PM
Ah well - I think bone-density is usually something females concern themselves with. A lot of it is probably the culture I grew up with as well (Japan - big focus on fish fish fish for good bones and health! ). But I like your "go with the flow" mentality, Bruce - do what works for you! I know running is probably not the greatest thing for my knees at times, or my hips, but on a nice day, it's almost a meditative experience for me. So I enjoy it. Maybe when my practice becomes more advanced, I'll find myself enlightened and realize yoga is all I need. |
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|  I suppose I should count my blessings...it's that time when the cardinals come out (and sometimes a bluejay if I'm lucky!) and every now and then I'll spot a deer or fox (this is, of course, until my pounding feet scare them away.) We humans can be so ungraceful. Your humor makes me feel quite welcome here, Bruce. Thanks a bundle! |
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| I didn't go jogging today--went and bought a new guitar instead--those two things are realated aren't they? Actually, I made some copies of old records onto CDs for my Bikram studio to play before and after class--I was changing and listening to James Taylor--couldn't get it out of my mind so figured, Hey I need a new guitar! And on the way home got one--my fingers are SO sore--takes away the pain from Bikram
amechan - 2004-04-24 2:36 PM
I suppose I should count my blessings...it's that time when the cardinals come out (and sometimes a bluejay if I'm lucky! ) and every now and then I'll spot a deer or fox (this is, of course, until my pounding feet scare them away. ) We humans can be so ungraceful. Your humor makes me feel quite welcome here, Bruce. Thanks a bundle! |
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| Please don't think of it as losing muscle!
You'll be surprised. Your body will change quite a bit, becoming longer and leaner.
Weight lifting creates shortened, bulky muscles. Check out the bend in your elbows when you try to straighten your arms. Can you? This is one of the first places weight lifters have trouble.
As you work through a yoga practice, you'll find safe extension opens the joints and makes the muscles around them more flexible, yet strong.
There are a lot of people who give up lifting when they get into an Ashtanga practice seriously. You're doing 72 chaturangas each practice (once you get into the entire thing). The one thing to keep in mind is that all these chaturangas are lowering down. To maintain tricep strength, most of us should actually lift UP the same number of times. But that move was removed from the series some years ago by Pattabhi. Anyway, to really work these mucles to the fullest extent possible, increasing the use of your body weight to effect bone density, you must learn to do a push up differently.
When you lower, HEAD UP. If you can see your hands, your head is in the wrong position. Look 2-3' ahead of you at the floor.
Your elbows should never, ever be higher than upper arms parallel to the rib cage. No "grasshopper" arms. Your elbows should also brush your ribs vs. being out to the side. Your shoulders should be lifted and not shooting down towards the floor. Tummy pulled in (uddiyana bandha) and bottom tucked, but don't clench the butt cheeks -- or your lips.
When you go into Urdhva Mukha Svanasana, your shoulders should be directly over your hands, which forces the backbend. If they're forward of your hands, you're not rolling your shoulders back and open, which reduces the weight-lifting effect. Weight lifters have a toughie with this one, because of tight, muscular backs. Keep working on it.
Then, the jump backs and throughs. Here are more weight bearing moves. Work on them! Again, 72 X 2 of them in each practice.
In yoga, form is far more important to maximize the benefits of an asana. We can all throw ourselves through a practice, but why? If we're going to do it at all, why not get the most out of it, right?
If you do continue to lift, which many do, change your focus a bit. You know how you're never supposed to let your arm completely straighten in a bicep curl (for example)? Well, slow it wayyyy down. Carefully and slowly take it down until your arm is completely straight, but keeping your shoulders fully integrated and spine erect. Count 3 in/exhalations. Make them even. REintegrate your shoulder and curl.
You'll feel a huge difference in your muscles, because you're elongating, causing an opposing contraction to lift. This is the same quad/ab action you must do in some of the backbends to lift. Anyway, it will help your practice to be strong, yet work with the Primary Series while you're elongating.
If you do the same with leg lifts, don't you dare (mom talking here) lock your knees. Instead, extend, and lift your toes to keep a "micro" bend in the knee. Hold, slowly release.
So you can, yet you don't have to stop. Many do. Most do, frankly. Yoga is such a total body thing that so much else becomes superfluous. I joke about not wanting to ever have to smell so much "health" again in my life.
Welcome to the most wonderful activity in the world!
Christine |
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| Thanks, Christine - your post is most helpful. I think I've come to a point where I really don't *feel* like lifting weights anymore. It just isn't "me" anymore, I suppose. I like that! How do you feel about keeping running in my regimen? I enjoy it, and I like running races once or twice a year (usually 10-milers or half marathons), and I'm not sure if I'm ready to give that up yet. I love how my body feels doing yoga. I still feel like my size (and like I said, it's not ALL muscle  ) gets in the way for some asanas, but I suppose I should just be patient. |
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| OK, I'm all inspired--I really am going to start running again--AFTER the sun saluations at 0530 hours.
amechan - 2004-04-26 12:03 PM
Thanks, Christine - your post is most helpful. I think I've come to a point where I really don't *feel* like lifting weights anymore. It just isn't "me" anymore, I suppose. I like that! How do you feel about keeping running in my regimen? I enjoy it, and I like running races once or twice a year (usually 10-milers or half marathons ), and I'm not sure if I'm ready to give that up yet. I love how my body feels doing yoga. I still feel like my size (and like I said, it's not ALL muscle ) gets in the way for some asanas, but I suppose I should just be patient. |
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| Bruce, dare I mention that I KNOW my body isn't meant for running long distances. So I'm probably not doing my knees any good by being stubborn about running. Maybe I should go out and buy a guitar, huh? But then my fingers would suffer (and the ears of all those around me - I certainly can't play!) Back to Christine's post, I will definitely add in the push-UP. Is it supposed to flow from up dog to down dog in one fluid movement? This seems to be the way David Swenson does it in his Primary Series DVD. But I also notice that he does things a little differently from what we do in the studio and I sometimes find myself feeling a bit embarassed. |
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| Woohoo--after 90 minutes of chatarangas and down dogs, I'm one sore dude. Oh yeah, today at Bikram, I finally figured out a proper floor bow--did I ever get a burn in my triceps--scared me a bit initially,..didn't see that coming.
amechan - 2004-04-26 3:01 PM
Bruce, dare I mention that I KNOW my body isn't meant for running long distances. So I'm probably not doing my knees any good by being stubborn about running. Maybe I should go out and buy a guitar, huh? But then my fingers would suffer (and the ears of all those around me - I certainly can't play! ) Back to Christine's post, I will definitely add in the push-UP. Is it supposed to flow from up dog to down dog in one fluid movement? This seems to be the way David Swenson does it in his Primary Series DVD. But I also notice that he does things a little differently from what we do in the studio and I sometimes find myself feeling a bit embarassed. |
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| Have you heard of a book called "Body, Mind & Sport"? It is a wonderful book for taking the philosphies of yoga and applying it to a western type of workout. I can't remember the author, but search the title and it should show up.
If you have trouble, email me at NiaDancerNYC@aol.com and I'll go look up the author.
That book changed my life and my workouts.
Jason |
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| Jason,
I haven't heard of it, but I'll check it out on Amazon. Just out of curiosity, what kinds of activities do you pursue outside of yoga? Did you find yourself keeping the same athletic hobbies after reading this book, or did you change/drop some of them? I often find that running is a meditative experience for me...well, not right now, as it's 90 degrees and the CICADAS have come! But I do find that yoga has augmented all other activities I choose to enjoy. I'll let you know if I have difficulty finding it. Thanks again for the recommendation.
Rayna |
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| Bruce,
I've always wanted to ask (and I know this isn't really the right forum or thread, for that matter), but how do you like Bikram? I mean no offense, but the thought of one human being trademarking his yoga scares me. However, I've read a number of articles in which people absolutely rave about it. Do you feel the heat, and the repetetion and order of the poses allows you to really get into your yoga practice? I know personally, that I love ashtanga because it so organized. (Sadly, I have to feel organized even when doing yoga.) Doing the same sequence of poses also allows me to better "feel" my body, if that makes sense. Not really measuring my progress per se, since that really isn't supposed to be a goal, but I can feel my body getting looser and, perhaps, getting back to where it should be. Oops, went off on a tangent. But yes, I'm interested to know more a bit about Bikram. Do you practice other forms?
Rayna |
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| I love the Bikram challenge Rayna and, despite it's faults, it introduced me to yoga and the big world it encompasses. I began reading and listening and learning and sampling the various physical forms to include Ashtanga and Power.
Going in that hot room and accomplishing something I never contemplated is a real high. I'm kind of a big yoga baby though because I really need teacher guidance and while most are very helpful, the few that aren't really tick me off because I'm a paying customer--that's not being a very good yogi is it? But, that's where I am in this wonderful new world. |
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| I find running to be a nice complement to my practice. The breath focus has definitely increased my stamina when I run, as well as strengthening my quads which has taken a lot of stress off my knees. In the past, my knees have prevented me from actually running for more than a minute or two, while now I'm at 5 or 6 before they start to be painful and it keeps improving. Since I dont have the upper body strength (NOTHING has helped...even my trainer boyfriend coaching me and creating an entire weight/stretching plan) to attempt ashtanga yet, my yoga practices tend to be less physically challenging (though not easy per se) and running also helps get that nice sweaty energized expulsion of excess energy that I'm not finding in practice. Why pick one or the other if you like both? |
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| Bruce: Thanks for the input. There's a studio out here run by an older veteran who claims Bikram was the only thing that helped his chronic pain due to military service. I suppose no matter what style of physical yoga practice you choose, if you find one that works for you, then that's what's "best" for you. I have the same feeling toward Ashtanga as you do toward Bikram. It's what brought me to yoga, and it allowed me to clear my head during some tough times, so it's the style I'll stick with consistently. But...ever curious, I think it's great to try other styles too!
Lora: I'll second that! I don't want to give up running or yoga. Both serve different physical purposes, but have the same mental effect for me. At least, that's how I feel. Regarding your upper body strength - keep at it! Have you considered trying Ashtanga to build upper body strength rather than using weights or other exercises to "work up to" Ashtanga? Personally, I feel stronger than I did when lifting weights. I guess I feel more "functional", if that makes sense. Out of curiosity, what is your primary form of yoga practice? |
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| Amechan,
I think we may live in the same area. When I was practicing yoga(Bikram), it was with an older veteran who stated the same in your post, that Bikram helped his disability (60% disabled). Currently, I'm on hiatus due to a pulled something or other in my knee area but I can't wait to get back. If you do decide to take a Bikram class, I would recommend this gentleman's class. Not only is he the most knowledgeable in the city, he also helps you with modifications which other instructors do not. He also tells you when you're way off the mark in terms of correct form; other Bikram instructors will allow you to go through the postures without correction (based on my experience at other studios). Please let me know if you go and how you liked it...or not!! |
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| Amechan,
Right now it's a very general Hatha practice. My main classes are at my gym, and I try to supplement those with free classes on the weekends a local studio. I stopped lifting weights for awhile and found that my strength felt dramatically decreased and started up again just recently. One of my teachers spends a lot of time on legs and hips, so we're not moving in and out of poses too much, and I think that's what ended up affecting me the most. Our sub on the other hand is used to working with HIV and cancer patients and is so thrilled to have a healthy class that she works us pretty hard. I have thought about picking up an ashtanga practice - all the beginning classes seem to be in the middle of the day here, though, so can't get there due to work. I also want to build up my shoulders a bit more before trying it as I have an issue with one of them that nags me in adhu muhka svanasana and chaturanga every now and again. I've previously taken classes that are similar in intensity, I believe, and that's where my heart lies. Definitely built up more strength there than anywhere else. |
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dropping weight lifting
