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| Some posts in another discussion sparked this thought: are most yogis kinder to animals because of an adherence to ahimsa and the general compassionate feelings that yoga brings about? Or are kind, compassionate, animal lovers just naturally drawn to yoga?
I don't have many local yoga friends, so I was stunned to find so many like-minded people at my teacher training. Every single one had a pet (or pets) that had been rescued from some terrible situation, and everyone had a great reverence for the trees and bugs that crossed our paths. One morning in class, a huge hairy icky spider crawled across the front row of mats, and everyone's face was a mixture of "EWWWWW" and "Oh the poor thing!" Our teacher exclaimed "Oh! a new friend . . . ?" and finally a brave burly male student gently picked the spider up in his bare hands and took him outside.
Personally I have 9 pets (3 dogs, 6 cats) who came from ugly situations, not counting the cats who hang out in the garage because of the food and heat lamps I provide. I have held a half-dead field mouse (one of garage cat's victims) and wept as he crossed over. I burst into tears when I accidentally sprayed soap on a dragonfly! And I can't count the number of times I've hopped out of my car on the interstate to chase an animal (dog, cat, turtle) away from traffic. I cry when I hear stories of animal abuse (even fake stories) and am considering putting the parental block on Animal Planet so I don't accidentally stumble onto a disturbing image.
I KNOW I'm not alone in acting this way, even though my non-yoga friends and coworkers think I'm a nut! So, which comes first? The yoga or the ahimsa?? |
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| And now I find out that I could have invited you to my house!? What with all the pets, I usually only invite people who really love us! At one point I had 14 cats and a dog, now we're down to 3 cats inside and one outside... what a relief! In answer to your question, I agree!Melissa |
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| I don't know the answer, but I know that I love animals. I just have the one cat right now, since I live in a studio, but that's necessity more than anything else. And with his 150000 different personalities, it's like a new cat every time I come home!
Your post reminded me of the time I had to save a duckling on one of the busier roads in my hometown...The mama duck and all of its brothers and sisters made it across the median, but poor little thing was bringing up the rear and couldn't get up over it! So naturally my mom and I stopped and I got out to help it and it ran under the car for cover. We finally got it out, and it wouldn't cross the street so I had to walk it over towards the rest of the family. I thought I was doing a good deed but the mama duck was not exactly understanding.....My mom couldn't drive for a couple minutes because she was laughing so hard at me tearing back to the car as the mama duck chased me across the street! 
Pets are great, though, and I can't even imagine not having my little guy around to torture me. |
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| I have only been practicing yoga for a fairly short while, and have always been an animal lover from a very young age. We have a dog, and 3 inside cats, and many barn cats, and 2 horses. Most of these critters have come to us from past abusive homes, or in the case of the cats-just dumped on us because we have a farm. They all find a good home here.
So, to answer your question-I think it works both ways. |
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| Oh Jean, I have found the perfect website for you!
http://www.savetoby.com
Now this is guaranteed to make you cry. 
PS: I was falling over laughing my @$$ off when I saw it. 
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| Don't you other ladies just want to smack him?  |
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Expert Yogi
Posts: 5098
 
Location: Somewhere in the Mountains of Western NC | Jean,
I think that there are lots of people that are compassionate towards animals that don't have a clue as to what Yoga is. In fact, at the animal rescue shelters in my area they are the most down to earth people I know. I rescue lots of animals, especially birds and raptors, but I cannot take care of every animal I rescue. Soo, I either take them to this particular shelter that rehabilitates them back into the wild or uses them for educational purposes for children and wildlife awareness. For the domestic ones, I find homes for them but keep them temporarily until I find something suitable and I get to choose who gets my animals. I too have a zoo at my house. All my dogs that I have ever had are rescued. I only have one now - a Rottweiler puppy who is absolutely the sweetest dog you will ever meet 4 mos. old (he tried to fish for Koi at a client's house over the weekend). I have 2 Solid Black North Carolina Bobtail cats that I rescued from the side of the road. Last but not least, I have a Festive Festiva Amazon Parrot named Yardbird who is approx. 39 years old that I rescued 6 years ago from a very unique situation in Monroe, Lousiana. My other parrots I have had, have come and gone in my life to better homes, but Yardbird remains here with me.
So, the best thing anyone can do is volunteer for your local animal shelter, donate your $$ to good animal shelters, and don't take animals in if you can't take care of them. You are not only doing a dis-service for yourself, but for the animal.
As I said earlier, some of the best animal people I know are the ones who live here out in the country. One of the local rescuers has a pet hedgehog, and she has been known to keep opposums from time to time (did you know they are the oldest creature on earth and have no way of carrying rabies?), and if you see them dead on the side of the road, sometimes they aren't dead, they are scared to death and play dead, or if they really are dead, if there is a mommy opposum with babies, the babies are usually alive and you can find 6 or 7 of them. They rehabilitate very nicely because they are scavengers and eat anything...and you can release them around your house and they go off on their merry way or hang around and eat your cat food - which probably is not good since they don't get along with cat's too well. Oh well. Racoons are the best!! although, I have a skunk that likes to eat my cat's food. I can always tell when he has been hanging around..it smells like coffee, very strong coffee.
Not to burst anyone's bubble here...but, when I saw the Dalai Lama a couple of years ago, he commented to us Americans and our attachment to animals. He said it was incorrect for us to be so attached to animals that we lost sight of our responsibility to humans. Another words, he said that human relationships were more important than the animals. Being kind to animals and taking care of them is a completely different thing that what the Dalai Lama is talking about. For instance, my Father treats his little dogs better than his children and treats them like human beings...this is wrong thinking. Anyway, I hope this doesn't make anyone mad since we Americans spend billions and billions of dollars on our animals and yet at the same time we have so many that are suffering in animal shelters. Did you know that in Atlanta, GA, if your dog gets found by the animal control and you don't claim it in 3 days it gets the death sentence?? That to me is horrifying and such a tragedy. The attitudes of the people working there is like so gross and is pure hell. So, having that said, I'm definitely one of the animal keepers of the world, I'm Ellymae and everybody brings me the wild animals and birds. Some people from Atlanta call me to take their animals so they can live in the countryside and be free. Oh well. I have gotten stronger in my mind about death and animals. This is the life and I quit getting so emotional about their fate, you sorda get to a point where you learn that you can't save everybody and you save the ones you can and put your energy into a life that can make it, bury the dead and honor it, but don't let it bring you down as it just makes you weak - especially when your working with so many. |
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| Dear Jean and others :
I wondered why the question was asked about animals, and with examples such as cats and dogs? I mean why it should not include humans, and other animals not mentioned, may be cows, pigs, and even tigers and lions.
Then, what I wondered was what does the kindness to these animals mean?
I find that human beings are the ONLY animals or non-animal animals who use other animals for their selfish reason, not instinctively but intentionally. For example, when a lion eats a rabit, he means no harm to rabit, he automatically feels like eating a rabit and does so. Later, he would not do anything to other rabits even if they pass him by. However, a human being will gather all rabits put them, breed them more by putting agents in them, use their skin for coats, eyes for something else, and then eat the meat with spices, and what not. And, he does the same with other animals, nay other human beings.
So, therefore, I feel that a true yogi is one who is kind to all animals including humans. And, also kindness means that he should use them only as little as possible, that is in an Unselfish way. Kindness does not have anything to do with Pets.
Neel Kulkarni
www.authenticyoga.org |
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| I dont have an opinion, but wanted to say I have a weird soft spot for lady bugs. I love them, I love watching them go out their buissness crawling about. I feel special when they fly or crawl to me. I name each one I see. Yesterday My DH and I were outside in the backyard, and I saw three climbing in the grass by one another. Their names were Elferd, Sue and Timothy. They are my friends.
(Ok, you can laugh and I know Im a nutcase. At least my husband thinks I am) |
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Expert Yogi
Posts: 8442
  
| Yeah - I have a little trouble with the "pampered pet" syndrome and the way the animals are so integrated into family life they can't be left at home for family holidays etc. We had lots of pets as kids and they were loved dearly but were never taken for teeth cleaning or chemo therapy or even grooming beyond a good brushing and some flea powder. (Well, we NEVER brushed the fish...  ) We don't have pets now because our lifestyle doesn't make sense to have a pet. Frankly, if I could afford to send a pet to a kennel while I went on holiday, I would prefer to upgrade the place I'M staying instead. I am also not keen on the idea of having to "scoop" for a pet since I work with babies and have quite enough dealings with fecal matter from little humans. Going home and having to do more of that in my spare time just doens't appeal somehow.
But yes, a lot of yoga people also seem to be animal people. Just not me |
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| Nope, me too. Joined the mailing preference service simply to make sure I avoided all photos of emaciated donkeys and the like. I have two spoiled rotten cats and a whole host of spiders as 'pets'. I was always this way but I think I'm getting worse (better?) with age
Fee |
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Extreme Veteran
Posts: 418
Location: New York | I love my cat dearly and have to admit that vacations are planned around when the woman who watches her (not all day- she just comes in once a day to feed, scoop and visit) is available. My cat is one of those who must be an only cat (Jean and Gruvemom- you guys have probably met a few like that!) and if it weren't for that (and my husband tempering my zeal), I would be one of those people with a houseful of one eyed, three legged cats.
I volunteer at a shelter and regularly contribute $ to them.
I don't know if there's a yoga/animal loving connection- I just wanted to write about my cat! |
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| It is so interesting to read everyone's opinions!
Neel, I completely agree that a true yogi should strive not to harm anything - human, non-human, insect, plant, earth, etc. That is much more all-encompassing than I had intended.
I was just thinking, if you rounded up a group of random people, for example 200 people working in an office building: I'd imagine about half of them would have pets, and maybe half of the pets would have come from shelters or rescue groups. But, if you had 200 yogis and yoginis, the percentage would be much higher, perhaps 80% or more? Of course, this is just my perception, and I was wondering if anyone else thought it might be true, so I asked!
Not to say that every animal lover has extremely pampered pets with diamond-studded collars and velvet pillows to lie upon . . . I don't even go to that extreme, but by most people's standards I'm a little bit crazy for my pets. They are great friends to me in a world that can be cruel. They bring me joy, and I love them dearly.
Cyndi, that is very interesting information about the Dalai Lama. I wonder how much is a product of his culture, and how much it is from his level of enlightenment. I had not thought about how this might be a strictly American phenomenon - we are a culture of extremes; some of us feed our cats in crystal bowls and others kill animals for sport. I'm not here to convince anyone that they're right or wrong, no person's view is no more or less valid than another's. That includes the Dalai Lama, Jane Goodall, and Ted Nugent! We're all on different paths and I respect that. But, I still distance myself from things that disturb me.
Sorry, I'm beginning to ramble!!  |
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| I agree with a lot that has been written here about the keeping of pets. I have my cat, and I love him to death, and he's my favorite little guy in the world...
Yet I find the keeping of animals for pleasure (including my own) a comical idea. Of course, anyone with a cat clearly understands that WE are the domesticated animals in that house and are subject to the whims of him or her!
It would be interesting to explore the history of the evolution of pets as we know them today. If I had the space I would definitely take on more rescue animals than just my current cat...I pass by the shelter on my way to school and it's so frustrating to see all the dogs and cats in there that deserve to be safe and well-fed. |
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Expert Yogi
Posts: 5098
Location: Somewhere in the Mountains of Western NC | The main idea here is to be kind to animals, of course, don't deplete their habitat's...but, most of all BE KIND TO HUMANS. Which means you should never place your animals above human life. I like the Hindu culture relating to the animal evolvement in relation to humans. I think Chinese have a similar version...but my husband say's their belief (not sure if this is a Nepalis belief only or Indian too), that the dog is the last animal that you would reincarnate before being a human being and that is why the dog is so close to man. Of course, Neelbhai could explain that better than I, but this came from Satyam and what he was taught from his elders.
Anyway, I love my animals but I am not attached to them. I lost my Doberman - Zig Tuk, of 5 years on the day of the Tsunami. I just found out that he was hit by a car on that day and the farmer that found him didn't know who he belonged to. My dog NEVER left my home, and he was discovered several miles away. I live on country roads that my dog knew very well and the traffic here is very minimal - you can walk for hours without ever seeing a human being or a car. I sincerely believe the earth's position that day was very unstable and my dog sensed that. I think it made him become disoriented and therefore, he lost his life. The good news is that he is free from being an animal and I hope he is happy where ever that may be. My wish is that his spirit would live on through my new dog - Yoda. |
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| Very interesting topic, Jean! I'm guessing the ahimsa comes before the yoga - at least that is so in my case - but perhaps it is different with others. I rescue bugs from being squished - which my family teases me about mercilessly - and feed the chipmunks, squirrels & birds in the backyard when I can afford to. I have a Lhasa Apso named Prince Joshua Snickerdoodle (Josh, who is in my avatar pic with me) who is spoiled rotten but he gives me such love that he fills my heart with joy. If I could, I'd have more pets - rescue animals - but I can't afford that right now - so maybe some other time. I'd love to work at a shelter but I'm terribly allergic to cats, unfortunately. But, as others have mentioned, the ahimsa goes further than that... I'm very much a pacifist - I'm against war or any violence, be it between humans or against animals. I can't understand the "sport" of boxing - why would people do that? I realise you're specifically asking about animals though. Two years ago I was on the phone with my brother, and going back & forth between the kitchen & patio while we talked & I smoked (a habit I have - thank God! - given up a year ago) At any rate, after going in & out 3 or 4 times I was headed back in & discovered a snake clinging to the brick wall about 8 inches from the door I had been going in & out of. I am terrified of snakes, and this was a young cottonmouth (ie water moccasin for those who don't know - very poisonous). I had been oblivious to his presence & he apparently didn't mind me going in & out. But once I saw him I nearly fainted of fright, got the dog in the house & was yelling at my brother on the phone "THERE'S A SNAKE OUT THERE!!!!!!" Eventually the snake went away - probably got tired of me standing in the kitchen in hysterics. I calmed down & went to work, and when I told my co-workers, many of them said, "Why didn't you kill it?!"  I told them, "you know I don't kill bugs... WHY would I kill a snake?!?" They didn't understand. I mean, if it attacked me, if it was a battle of life & death between me & the snake, MAYBE I'd have killed it... but otherwise... WHY?????? So... wanna hear something crazy? Face to face, snakes terrify me. But I love to watch them on tv, or at the zoo behind glass (I guess where I know they can't hurt me) I'm fascinated with them in that respect. My mom is so terrified by snakes that she can't even watch them on tv. Go figure... Okay, I'll shut up now! LOL
Namaste! Echo |
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Expert Yogi
Posts: 5098
Location: Somewhere in the Mountains of Western NC | The next time you see a snake coming into your house...remember to feed him some milk. Yes, that is what my husbands family does for the Cobras back in Nepal and they really do drink it. They worship the Snakes, they are a form of Shiva - according to my husband's culture. They bring good things into your house - prosperity, good health, etc. and takes the evil spirits and negative energies from your house. They are only passing through, they don't want to stay. He might of had a past connection to your house and you built on top of his favorite place. If you see a King Snake...welcome him with open arms as he will keep the poison snakes at bay and will actually eat them. I once saw a King snake eat a Copperhead. King Snakes are very nice to have around and so are cats. |
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| Cyndi - 2005-04-14 12:44 PM The next time you see a snake coming into your house...remember to feed him some milk. Yes, that is what my husbands family does for the Cobras back in Nepal and they really do drink it. They worship the Snakes, they are a form of Shiva - according to my husband's culture. They bring good things into your house - prosperity, good health, etc. and takes the evil spirits and negative energies from your house. They are only passing through, they don't want to stay. He might of had a past connection to your house and you built on top of his favorite place. If you see a King Snake...welcome him with open arms as he will keep the poison snakes at bay and will actually eat them. I once saw a King snake eat a Copperhead. King Snakes are very nice to have around and so are cats. Oh gosh, FEED the snakes? Well, I won't kill them, but I don't know if I'll feed them either! LOL I have heard of the milk thing... however... uh, if I give a cottonmouth milk will it go away??? I'm kind of afraid it would kill me first! (Do we have king snakes here? I know we have eastern diamondbacks... ugh, I don't even like to think about it!) I've heard of pentacostal churches who handle poisonous snakes in their churches as part of their worship - I think the theory is that the Holy Spirit will protect them, and if they get bitten and die, well, that was just their fate. I definitely don't worship snakes... my culture tends to vilify them, though I think they're just another animal... I just happen to fear them! LOL (On a side note, funny, I don't fear spiders, though some of them are poisonous as well... I wonder why?) Off to ponder all this!
Echo |
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| I didn't know that about the milk! That is interesting . . . will it make the snakes go away or will it make them come back for more? My parents have Massasagua (sp?) rattlers on their land, and my dad is deathly afraid of them. But they have found, like with most of the wild animals, they will not bother anybody if left alone. They seem a lot more content to share the land than we humans are!
Although, they did have some wild turkeys take over their yard one year. It got so bad that we would hide in the house until they got distracted because they would attack people on the way to the car! I couldn't get out of the car one day, they surrounded my vehicle and were pecking at the doors! I was like "Wow, look at the beautiful turkeys! Oh my gosh, they're coming over here . . . uh oh . . . HELP!!!" 
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| That's hysterical, Jean! Surrounded by wild turkeys... I see a tv movie in this...  ROFL! I was once trapped for nearly two hours in a port-a-potty by a loose and viscious doberman when I was a teenager... but that's another story altogether Sad but true! (I survived the encounter without injury but had to run home 5 blocks at top speed around 3am!) One of those incidents you just never forget...
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| I see too that this goes beyond having and loving pets. Kind of spreads out to all of nature, I guess. I garden organically, and wouldn't ever think of using chemicals. For my family eating the food, of course, but also for the impact on the plant life, and the insect life-the whole cycle. Composting, and recycling-ii is all a part of this, don't you think? I get just as much pleasure watching a hummingbird at the nectar of a flower, as I do petting the cat sitting on my lap. And humans too, ever realize just how many children are out there in need of loving homes? The foster system is full of such children in need. Well, I am not going to get started there.- couldn't stop once I got on my soap box. |
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| I love and respect all animals. I also believe one should treat an animal as an animal.
I seriously question the intellectual apptitudes of people who mollycoddle their pets like they were children. Mad magazine had a classic comic version of what people say and what they really mean that is so applicable to those people: When they say I love animals they actually mean I hate people! Pets really don't appreciate Prada anymore than they do tinned food! I would rather feed homeless people than smother my pets in un-natural luxury.
Often when stuck on finding an answer to a question I ask myself what would happen in the wild?
I must admit, I'm the first to help an animal or insect back to its natural habitat. If a bug is stuck in the pavement or pool I'd hapily pick it up and relocate it to the nearest leafy patch, but, despite the guilt that overwhelms me, when a huge frikkin spider crosses my lines its squish!Ssorry!
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| I Like snakes. My sister has one ball python. I like to hold her and watch TV sometimes, or chat with my sister. I haven't seen her for awhile though. Not since I've had the baby. My husband is scared of them and it freaks him out. |
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| I like snakes too--they make lovely shoes. I figure I did alot of good buying my latest pair--employed some folks in Brazil and have one less freaking snake in the world. Just supporting nature's law of survival of the fittest--my fit is an 11D... |
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| I've been looking forward to having Bruce weigh in on this subject! |
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Kindness to animals
