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| i used to like a good belgian beer or a couple of glasses of red wine or some quality champagne a few times a week. and the occasional mojito. i never drunk big quantities, but i did drink regularly.
then gradually i started to get the worst hangovers, at the end even half a glass of wine would make me feel the next day as if i'd had a bottle of whiskey. so i was forced to quit, it wasn't a choice really.
at first i was frustrated. but now, a year and a half later, i am so terribly grateful that my body forced me to quit.
my family and old friends drink a lot, and when they re drunk they are such unpleasant company compared to when sober. i never noticed that before. i don't judge them, i ve been there and done that, but i am so relieved that i am not tempted to go there anymore. it does create some tensions though, they really do not like it that i no longer drink. interesting phenomenon to observe.
actually, i thought for a while that i'd developed an allergy of some kind, and that that was the reason why i didn't tolerate alcohol anymore, but now i think more and more that it's the yoga.
the same thing is going on with food - getting hypersensitive to anything bad. it makes it easy to make healthy choices - but socially it's a bit of a problem sometimes. then, i guess i can learn from this too. even though i mostly ate healthily when by myself, i used to be the kind of person who would eat crap to please others when in company. since my body has become so sensitive, i can no longer do that, and am forced to stand up for myself and my principles... good practice. thank you body.  |
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| tourist - 2006-08-05 11:31 AM
And to go back to alcohol and simplistic rules....I'll never forget the day my 8 year old son saw me drinking a coffee (or something ) in the car and spouted "Mommy, you know you shouldn't drink and drive!" 
Lots of things are like that. When you're older things get a bit more complex, and that it's not as cut and dried as you were taught in school.
Red grapes have all the benefits of red wine without the alcohol.
Today we have clean water.
Sure, those were just examples of reasons why in the past it made more sense to drink beer and wine than water.
since my body has become so sensitive, i can no longer do that, and am forced to stand up for myself and my principles... good practice. thank you body.
I'm finding myself with less and less tolerance for people who want to push me into doing something that will hurt my body in some way. I've got a friend who can be a bit overbearing, and pushy, and tends to dominate conversations.
Usually this doesn't bother me, because he usually got something interesting to say, but sometimes I find he keeps me at his house past the time I would want to be there. Often times I'll say "I'm going home now," and he'll drag me back into some other conversation, or go off on another tangent. We can on and on like this for hours, until finally he gets tired of it or something.
Anyway, last time I was over at his house it was getting late, and I looked at him and said, "It's late, I'm going home", stood up and promptly left. |
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| When my husband went into rehab last year, I decided to give up alcohol all together. To be honest, I was over it.. a little pissed off at it (of course, I blamed the alcohol). When I did give it up (for me, no prob, food is my drug of choice), I turned to sugar for the first time in my life. Before, I could've cared less about ice cream or candy.....but with the stress of him in rehab, my needing to run the business all alone, not knowing the fate of our relationship, and a whole slew of garbage... it came on pretty strong. My big wall of denial came crashing down during this time and I realized I was in full-blown relapse with my eating disorder.
Now, my husband has 18mo sobriety, and I have 15 mo. recovery. I no longer drink alcohol or caffiene. I no longer eat sugar as well. I limit my soda to 1 or 2 diet ginger ale/week. I tell you what, though, I feel better than I have in ages! I haven't been sick at all in the last 15 mo. I do not miss the "groggies" from booze. And, to tell you the truth, I have just as much fun without it. Luckily now, I have a strong program of recovery to help prevent me from eating for emotional reasons.
But kudos to you all who can eat and drink whatever..... I have just accepted the fact that isn't for me. I operate better with a set of rules and guidelines by which to live my life...
I found that regularly practing yoga helps me with my body image and my stress levels- which, in turn, encourage me to take care of myself. I find that I do not want to engage in self- destructive behaviors anymore. |
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| joscmt - 2006-08-13 1:26 AM
When my husband went into rehab last year, I decided to give up alcohol all together. To be honest, I was over it.. a little pissed off at it (of course, I blamed the alcohol). When I did give it up (for me, no prob, food is my drug of choice), I turned to sugar for the first time in my life. Before, I could've cared less about ice cream or candy.....but with the stress of him in rehab, my needing to run the business all alone, not knowing the fate of our relationship, and a whole slew of garbage... it came on pretty strong. My big wall of denial came crashing down during this time and I realized I was in full-blown relapse with my eating disorder.
Now, my husband has 18mo sobriety, and I have 15 mo. recovery. I no longer drink alcohol or caffiene. I no longer eat sugar as well. I limit my soda to 1 or 2 diet ginger ale/week. I tell you what, though, I feel better than I have in ages! I haven't been sick at all in the last 15 mo. I do not miss the "groggies" from booze. And, to tell you the truth, I have just as much fun without it. Luckily now, I have a strong program of recovery to help prevent me from eating for emotional reasons.
But kudos to you all who can eat and drink whatever..... I have just accepted the fact that isn't for me. I operate better with a set of rules and guidelines by which to live my life...
I found that regularly practing yoga helps me with my body image and my stress levels- which, in turn, encourage me to take care of myself. I find that I do not want to engage in self- destructive behaviors anymore.
August 15, this Tuesday, will be five years NO alcohol for me.
I too needed sugar when I stopped drinking. It took about 2 years and a recommitment to my yogasana to finally find the strength within to face up to the reality of it all.
I went from over 400 to under 260, now, and I'm a big guy--6'9'' so I always carried the weight, but now I look much better, and my spirit is much better.
I've found that my yogasana really helps clean up the mess left behind by so many years of less than perfect living. Not that I'm living in divinity now, but at least I've got my sights set on a higher ground.
I just want you to know that, I been there, and can hear you, and know what it's like. |
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| Craving sugar makes sense. Beer and wine contain tons of sugar, which is what the yeast eat, until they produce so much alcohol that they die in their own poisons. So with no drinking your body was looking to get it's sugar fix someplace else. |
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Expert Yogi
Posts: 8442
    
| SCT - do you have a party or something to mark the special day? I think AA folk do little medals and a ceremony, yes? I really like the idea of some little ritual, even if it is just something small you do on your own. Shall we have a party here? I'll bring chips! |
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| tourist - 2006-08-13 1:07 PM
SCT - do you have a party or something to mark the special day? I think AA folk do little medals and a ceremony, yes? I really like the idea of some little ritual, even if it is just something small you do on your own. Shall we have a party here? I'll bring chips!
Grace, at the dinner table.
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Extreme Veteran
Posts: 418
Location: New York | GreenJello - 2006-08-04 12:16 PM
[
I really don't consider have a few to be off the path, far from it. The people who are completely and utterly NO BEER, are just as much of the drinking game as the people who are drinking constantly. This is part of the problem with AA, though it's definitely better than drinking, it's still a game of sorts.
You give the impression that you know an awful lot about alcoholism and alcoholics . . . what is your experience with AA? Have you ever actually been to an AA meeting or talked with someone who is actively working the 12 steps/integrating the program of AA into their lives?
I quit drinking 3 years ago (May 9, 2003). I don't care to share the details of my experiences in this public forum but suffice it to say I found it prudent to put down the drink (God willing) for good. I don't care if people drink or not (my husband still drinks) but I won't be around drunks.
And for what it's worth, practicing yoga had absolutely no effect in helping me to quit. |
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| JackieCat - 2006-08-14 10:46 PM
And for what it's worth, practicing yoga had absolutely no effect in helping me to quit.
What sort of yoga do you do? Do you view it as more than just exercise? How long have you been doing it? Do you do anything more than asana practice? What have been the effects of your practice? |
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| Today is FIVE years and no alcohol.
Woot!
That's the longest in my life[no joke], taking into consideration every little sip of beer and wine I've ever had, and every fishing trip as a young lad.
Yoga has played an extensive role in my ability to self analyze and honestly deconstruct the ego that depended on alcohol. Rebuilding post alcohol is quite a responsibility that I guess I never considered with as much sacred seriousness as i do now.
Namaste. |
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| SCThornley - 2006-08-15 1:34 PM
Yoga has played an extensive role in my ability to self analyze and honestly deconstruct the ego that depended on alcohol.
Which it should do with all our deamons....
Congrats Steve! |
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| thank you.
always-practice, practice, practice  |
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Extreme Veteran
Posts: 418
Location: New York | I started out with Bikram. I got tired of the hot room so I no longer do Bikram. Now I just do regular yoga (not sure how else to describe it)- vinyasa or power yoga. I've been doing yoga regularly for about 5 years.
In addition to exercise and increasing strength and flexibility, I view it as a way to help me to stay present in the moment by coordinating breath and movement. I try to take that out of the yoga room and into my regular life.
By other than asana practice, do you mean meditation and chanting? I do meditate, but not super regularly. I don't chant. |
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As far as my experience go, they can't compare to yours. All I was originally attempting to do was share some interesting insights I found in this book, and doing a poor job of explaining a very complex subject. I seriously recommend you read the book, and get your info first hand.
JackieCat - 2006-08-15 5:31 PM
In addition to exercise and increasing strength and flexibility, I view it as a way to help me to stay present in the moment by coordinating breath and movement. I try to take that out of the yoga room and into my regular life.
Good. I know lots of gymnasts, but few yogis.
By other than asana practice, do you mean meditation and chanting? I do meditate, but not super regularly. I don't chant.
Yes, I think everybody needs something that will give you an objective view point on their own mechanisms. I also find that both meditation and yoga make me much happier and centered, so that I don't want to mess that feeling up with alcohol, drugs, lack of sleep, hanging out with toxic people, or any other manner of things that are bad for me. When I'm not as happy or contented, I'm much more likely to do things that aren't good for me, such as drink.
Anyway, this is all my opinion, I could very well be completely off. (Or at least not explaining myself very well) |
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Extreme Veteran
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Location: New York | I'm not really complaining that yoga didn't "cure" my drinking problem as I am noting that doing yoga didn't really help me to stop. I had to take more drastic measures that I won't go into here. I know I don't take yoga as seriously as some of the posters here do- I approach it in such a way that it stays fun for me. I don't expect it to cure my ills. I do try to practice spiritual principles and integrate them into my life, and some of them line up with yoga philosophy. This just isn't stuff I think about when I'm doing a downward facing dog. |
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| JackieCat - 2006-08-15 10:03 PM
I'm not really complaining that yoga didn't "cure" my drinking problem as I am noting that doing yoga didn't really help me to stop.
Fair enough.
I know I don't take yoga as seriously as some of the posters here do- I approach it in such a way that it stays fun for me. I don't expect it to cure my ills.
Okay, I'm just pointing out that you're going to get out what you put in. I think the reason that our experiences may be different is two things. First, I've never had a serious problem with alcohol. Second, I probably put more into my practice. So it's probably a combination of a weak desire for drink and a strong practice. If the desire for drink was stronger, the practice might not have made much of a difference. |
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Expert Yogi
Posts: 5098
Location: Somewhere in the Mountains of Western NC | I have to agree somewhat with Jackie here. In my experience with AA and Al-anon, it is NOT a complete practice. I discovered Yoga or should I say alternative approaches after I was so frustrated with the "games" that I observed with the whole AA and Al-anon concept. This was many moons ago. However, my ex-husband and Mother-in-law are still in the program today, as are many friends that I've met over the years. I think it is wonderful that they have "something", but for me, it was obviously very limiting and not enough. I was not AA, I was in Al-anon. Reading AA's Blue Book was very intriquing to me when dealing with my ex-husband years ago. I like to think of Al-anon as a stepping stone.
Having that said, Yoga, not just Hatha Yoga & Vedanta Philosophy, but various other forms which includes Tibetan Buddhism, Tai Chi Qi Gong, Zen Philosophy and others, are definitely what I would consider complete as far as training the mind, balancing the body and gaining spiritual insight in self-realization. Sometimes when I look back and have conversations with AA'ers, I see lots of similarities of a potentially good practice, however, there are so many other aspects of the human body system and living a completely balanced life - there are too many gaps and too much left unsaid and not observed. The AA and Al-anon concepts are good, but there has to be a point where you have to move on, otherwise you become "dependant" on AA and Al-alanon, which is where the danger lies....its that whole "dependant" issue at play, its also about "good association" with others who may or may not be sincere about what they are doing, and who like Jackie mentioned, "playing games with themselves". It's also about where people are at with their karma, their understanding, what they are willing to accept and practice. Doesn't this sound familiar with Yoga as well?? I personally got very tired of being around that atmosphere, (believe me it didn't take very long) with people who were on merrygoround of denial and just basically couldn't get a handle on how to live - daily. BUT, on the other hand, they didn't have the correct tools or proper guidance to get them on the right track. Part of the reason for this is that Sponsorship in AA is very important, however, "good" sponsors or AA Guru's if you will, are very hard to find these days and there again, even their knowledge is very limited, because all you have is the sponsor's level of wisdom and experience, which may or may not be condusive to your level of understanding and/or advancement. Sometimes, the generation gap is far too great to reach the ones entering into AA and Al-anon these days.
My experience is that I moved on a long time ago. I respect the program to a degree and feel it is a great "stepping stone" for anyone who has a problem with drinking. Alcoholism is a "spiritual" disease, however, there are some physical aspects to consider (which they are not according to the bible of AA). According to Chinese Medicine Theory, there are some imbalances within the human body to consider, also genetics are another. These things can be treated and should be analyzed...but they are not, which is unfortunate, because its not all about drinking, it is about a human body being out of balance as well.
Interesting topic here. Although, it is a very complicated one. I say Yoga is a great avenue to explore if you are familiar with alcoholism and have reached a level of what AA would call, "hitting rock bottom". I just think there needs to be some serious inquiry in relation to the physical aspect before you embark upon the yoga path. If you are sincere and can literally stop drinking, go for yoga, and try to find a guru and explain your situation to him/her. If you find yourself having problems with on and off again drinking, then you really should consult with either a medical practitioner (which in my experience, will only send you to the program such as AA or some kind of detox, then AA), or an alternative health option - which could be Traditional Chinese Medicine, Ayurvedic medicine or possibly a holistic approach. These are very good, but need patience and diligence, as they take time to establish.
Edited by Cyndi 2006-08-18 3:50 PM
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Expert Yogi
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| Cyndi - I think you raise some good points. From what I understand of AA, it was a couple of guys who just got together to support each other and one of them had some pretty good ideas about how they could do that. It is a good start and for most people, that is where they start to take their baby steps toward a better life. For some, that is enough. For some, they need more. Thank goodness we have so many other choices to help us seekers |
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Extreme Veteran
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Location: New York | Cyndi- I think you are confusing me with someone else (GJ, maybe?) In my experience, while I have definitely witnessed game playing at some levels, on a conceptual level I haven't really found that AA is rife with games.
Regarding dependence on AA, my experience has been that AA teaches reliance (or dependence, if you will) on a power greater than oneself. There are definitely similarities to AA's philosophy and the philosophy of certain yoga masters- I have found Erich Schiffmann's philosophy of yoga to be remarkably similar to AA's third step- aligning your will with the will of God as you understand Him (Her/It/Whatever It Is.)
Cyndi - 2006-08-18 3:48 PM
Alcoholism is a "spiritual" disease, however, there are some physical aspects to consider (which they are not according to the bible of AA). According to Chinese Medicine Theory, there are some imbalances within the human body to consider, also genetics are another. These things can be treated and should be analyzed...but they are not, which is unfortunate, because its not all about drinking, it is about a human body being out of balance as well.
AA does consider and address the physical aspects of alcoholism. "The Doctor's Opinion" (which is an introduction of sorts to ALCOHOLICS ANONYMOUS, otherwise known as the "Big Book") talks about the alcoholic's physical allergy to alcohol. It is the allergy that activates the physical craving that occurs when the alcoholic drinks (and which is why it is the first drink that gets you- the alcoholic- drunk). However, as a friend of mine says, if that were all there was to it, rehab would be kicking out winners. Once the physical part is addressed, the alcoholic has to work on the mental/spiritual aspect or, according to AA, he/she will drink again. |
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| i wish and hope that my SIL goes to meetings (NA, AA, OA/FAA). i do not know if she is active, but i also know that she's really resistant to AA because she feels ashamed and doesn't want to be labeled or label herself.
but the meetings really do work for a lot of people, and i know that they would work for her if she would work them.
one summer, i spent a lot of time with a friend who lived in this awesome mansion right on a resevoir (that was also a place where one could swim, canoe, etc) that was so beautiful. she rented a room in this house and we had awesome parties and bon fires there. She was in FAA, and the other person who lived there was in AA. They often had "-A" parties there--which were really fun and cool. It was really great to hang out with people who were working hard to better themselves, and i got a lot of clients through it. LOL
it was a great summer, really. my friend (in FAA) does intuitive readings and is awesome, she is also a bhakti yogini and would lead kirtans by the bon fires and we would do all kinds of cool rituals out there like writing goals and burning them or 'making apologies' that maybe we couldn't make in person and burning those. And the swimming, running in the flower gardens, veggie gardens and fields and woods around the place--it was just picture perfect.
a really romantic summer. |
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| I have seen both sides of this picture. I have seen great recovery, and I have seen "dry drunk". With 12-step, as with anything, you get what you put into it. I find a lot of the principles of 12-step to be in complete alignment with yoga philosophy. I work a 12-step program very diligently- I am in OA/HOW- how is a more disciplined sect of OA. In it, I call my sponsor daily (no, she is not an OA-guru- they are not gurus- they are people with some of the same experiences), I do a reading and writing assignment daily, I write down my food for the day and commit it to my sponsor (with food it's tricky- imagine being an alcoholic and committing to only 5 shots a day), I read my assignment to her- now, in comparison, I know people who call their sponsor every now and then, don't work the steps or principles, and basically do not change. Much in the same way I know people who do yoga once/week as a workout and leave it at that.
In terms of the labeling, there is confusion with this with people not in program. Once you surrender to the healing process, standing before a group and saying, "Hi, I'm Marylisa, compulsive overeater" is not me giving myself a lablel- rather, it's me humbling myself before a group of people. An exercise in ego-reduction. I am admitting my problem instead of hiding from it or covering it up.
My world has changed as a result of the 12-steps and my hard work... I know hundreds of others in the same boat- hell, there are 7 of us in recovery at my restaurant alone! |
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| see, i told ya'll she has lots to be proud of.  |
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Expert Yogi
Posts: 8442
| jo - I am curious to know if your eating disorder had anything to do with your choice of career? I am reading all of your restaurant references with deep interest as my daughter is about to graduate from cooking school and already has had several offers from "big" restaurants. If you have any advice you would like to pass on to her about the biz, send me a PM |
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| i can't answer for jo, but i can tell you about what experience i do have (by proxy).
my sister in law was bulemic before becoming alcoholic and a drug addict. she didn't work in restaurants until after she was already in the disorder. my friend who is a member of FAA (food addicts anonymous) has never worked in the restaurant industry.
for many people, eating disorders develop out of behavoiral problems. the disoders are largely about a sense of control, particularly when an individual feels powerless (it is their way of gaining power). this is the case in regards to my SIL. She's symptomatic of the family 'dis-ease' (psychological and behavoiral relational patterning).
my friend, on the other hand, has a more biological component. her body reacts to sugar, flour, and wheat as an alcoholic does to alcohol--as if it's an 'allergen' that sends her mind-body into certain biochemical pathways that manifest like manic-depression. this then leads to certain behavoiral patterns that become engrained into the brain, which are then supported and set off by continued influx of the chemicals. So, she abstains from all flour, all sugar (even some sugary fruits), and all bread and so on. When she does, she is clear as a bell--but still needs help with behavoiral reactivity and the difficults of being abstinate in a culture that totally isn't!
largely, people develop eating disorders because of underlying biochemical or psychological issues. it is rare that an individual will develop one just because they work in a restaurant.
does that help mama relax about her baby? i'm sure mama did a good job and baby is going to be fine. |
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| allergen
that's how my body reacts to alcohol, for sure.
I'm so glad that I don't drink any longer. |
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yoga & booze
