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| Can you kindly tell this in different words. I think I did not understand this post. What is 'spitting', etc? bounder - 2007-11-11 9:35 AM
This may not be relevant but nonetheless I thought it was interesting. I work w/ an MD psychiatrist who is Hindu royalty who sits w/ a picture of her realized being on her desk. She is one life away from being @ the end of her path (self realization). However, if she has an impure thought or perhaps someone of a lower caste spits on her she will have to do it again. How frustrating. That is real tradition and rather binding! |
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| Spittng like shooting saliva out of a person's mouth on another person. |
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| Hi, I am new in this site. Self Realization is the zenith of my spiritual goals. I am sure this is going to be a great experience for me to share the little that I know about Realization and to learn from the members on this site.
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| Hi, I am new in this site. Self Realization is the zenith of my spiritual goals. I am sure this is going to be a great experience for me to share the little that I know about Realization and to learn from the members on this site.
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| Hi all, For me Self Realization is the zenith of my goals that I call spiritual goals. I know that to reach this goal I have to go thru a process by practicing Meditation in order to experience the Enlightenment that will take me attain Self Realization.
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| Aaaaahammmmm |
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Member
Posts: 28
| jermay88 - 2006-09-05 1:08 PM
What does it mean when it states 'self realization'? Is it something to do with seeing the world as it is? Wouldnt this be more down the lines of meditation?
Are we one or are we many?
Most of us have no problem appreciating that we are all distinct individuals.
Few of us appreciate that we are all also manifestations of a single being.
Underneath all the physical and psychological layers we have the same center.
To know you are that center, the center of all, is to have self realization.
Most of us habitually identify with the physcial and psychological aspects of who we are, especially the ego.
Meditation is a practice of going into, or at least nearer to, the center. |
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| Thank you all, I enjoyed this sharing.
Humbly, realiz(s)ation (or whatever term employed) IS a non-path non-goal in that one is always realized; it is only that one thinks they are not realized due to limiting beliefs and concepts to which they cling that are ephemeral and thus subject to the dance of karmic change, or suffering. The WAY is to know thy self through as little reflections as possible until self IS. How difficult would it be to line up 100 mirrors, each at different angles, to then align a single reflected point? This is a lot of work, and it is still ONLY a reflection -- this is seeking.
There is no right or wrong; for every reflection reflects to teach a being that there is no reflection.
Realization is the direct path through one's experience. If we follow the material forms and teachings we are only then actors (egos) addicted to the seeking and thus we suffer. No matter what we "learn" we are still only spiritualized and educated actors. Books and teachers and paths are great in that they are endless and unique pointers (reflections) back into us, but these are only relativity at play. One day all beings will confront themselves and realize that the one and only "path" is through themselves. Know Thy Self.
What am I thinking and why and how is this affecting my experience? Observe the mind and the surface will settle revealing deeper and deeper layers to observe. Keep observing. What am I believing? What thoughts have collected and stagnated (weed-like) in my heart-garden and how are they limiting? What am I afraid of, and is there anything truly to fear? What is more relevant than knowing thy self? If we memorize histories and other’s experience, is this not only traveling AWAY, and through a path of mirrors?
Am I alive, dead, or neither? What is observing these thoughts and hands and this Earth? How can “I” still be aware of all that I can observe? Who is observing? Keep observing, and as you do the inner structures will break down from not being fed with illusory (ego) energetic awareness and subsequently carried away on the winds of time.
What is really going on within me that is creating these misunderstandings?
To realize, all that we THINK we are must be observed and understood as it is, so true knowing may surface, or BE.
One must know the inner-architecture to know self.
Take the mystery away. Semantics and terminologies and mythologies and theologies and spiritualities only eventually need to be released to Know. Knowledge can only destroy knowledge. All you put in to yourself will only one day need to be observed and return to the world of forms to know. Emptiness is the trumpet of self. Words and forms are not self. No-thing is what you are.
Keep it simple. The last thing a person is attracted to is the space within themselves (nobody wants to accept that they have made mistakes (grown) or that they do not understand) so they remain numb with media input and material games and perambulate through the mirrors) and thus the "path" is continually created like a tight-rope between yesterday and tomorrow when in fact only this moment and what you (they) are being IS real. There is a single point that IS; so do all that you can to deepen into the soil of this moment. If you continually drag a plant (being) and its roots (mind) through the Earth (Maya[or, illusion]) it never has the maturity of Now to bloom (realize) or embed its roots.
Embed your roots!
If you truly want to know, and have this longing NOW (be prepared for this will rock your world because this is a guaranteed and applicable teaching to TRUTH), then STOP, SIT, and OBSERVE (meditate) your inner and outer space (for they are one) until you know. Recognize the impetus to step into more reflections and stop, and continue to observe. Own your life so you can then give it back to God and BE free and the peace you ARE. When we observe through meditation we are then currently disassociated with what we are observing (i.e. seeing the forest once you are out of the trees) and who we "think” we are will naturally energetically disentangle and return to the material energetic matrix, and then WE, GOD, Brahman, the SELF, etc. is revealed; and what one thought was its center of being then "shifts" to the center of self, which is actually no center, but everywhere, and one realizes that they were/are never born or die, thought these thoughts or suffered at all and are free from ALL of this. No matter the dream, when we awaken we realize it was/is only a dream and that WE are untouchable.
Intellect will realize and experience being more than a body, or sexual identity, or being born or dying, or more than all the collected fears, or more than archeyypes and mythologies and Gods and Goddesses and etc. Intellect will be eclipsed and diluted in the ocean of knowing and SELF IS.
Until EVERYTHING is understood as a reflection - keep observing and allowing Maya to reveal Maya. Illusion exists to show you there is no illusion.
Again, after one tires and then realizes that the entire experience is only a reflection; and yes, maybe one can save the world and become a savior or avatar or whatever, but this is still only a reflected dream-savior and not the self, they, through sheer exhaustion will collapse (metaphorically) and realize as the SUN of self bursts through the clouds of mind that there is only ONE, and that they are THAT.
I am a simple man here, and thus these are simple explanations and offerings.
Concerning Killing Buddha: How can one kill themselves? We are all Buddha; for there is only ONE, is the teaching.
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| I hope this helps. Although different terminology is used in Sufism, Hinduism and Buddhism, the basic state of initial realisation (kensho) in all traditions requires the student to directly experience self and reality as Sunyata ('emptiness') and as non-duality. This state may or may not be complete (satori), but, using higher forms, such as Mahamudra and Dzogchen, kensho can be taken to a full and permanent state.
The following is useful guidance to help test a student's level of 'attainment', showing the different ways that realisation can manifest.
"...The Questions of the Contemplative Nyimo Gomchen and the Responses of Sakya Pandita
I reverently bow at the feet of the Holy Guru! The glorious Sakya Pandita wrote the following lines to Nyimo Gomchen, a contemplative filled with faith and spiritual aspiration, applying himself earnestly to his practice: In response to your questions:
In realizing the nature of the mind (Realisation), is there a complete grasp of the meaning of the Three Collections of Teachings and the Four Classes of Tantras?
There are two realizations: Realizing the emptiness of the mind, and realizing the union of apparent reality and the emptiness of mind. In realizing the emptiness of the mind, one does not fully grasp the meaning of the Three Collections of Teachings and the Four Classes of Tantras. With such realization one may fully comprehend the Cessation of a Listener (Shravaka), but since that cessation falls to the extreme of emptiness alone, one would not grasp the meaning of the Mahayana teachings. This is stated in all the Mahayana Sutras and Tantras. In realization of the union [of apparent reality and emptiness], there is no blemish of even the most subtle faults. It therefore holds the basis of morality, and the Collection of Vinaya is complete. Since the Heroic Samadhi and all other states of concentration arise [from such realization], the collection of Sutras is complete. Since it cognizes all knowable things, from form to the Omniscient Mind, the collection of Abhidharma is complete. And due to its comprehension of the special outer and inner dependently-related events, the Four Classes of Tantra are complete.
Are the Three Jewels complete in one's own mind? In the mere emptiness of the mind and the understanding of that emptiness, the Three Jewels are not complete. In the union of the cognition and emptiness of the mind, the seeds of the Three Jewels are complete. If one properly realizes the meaning of that union, the Three Jewels are manifestly complete.
Is a person who realizes the emptiness of the mind a Buddha?
One who has realized emptiness alone is not a Buddha. If one comprehends all knowable things, one is fully enlightened. Furthermore, there are two modes of comprehension, the comprehension that there is no realization of an ultimately (i.e. inherently) existent phenomenon; and the comprehension of all distinct, conventionally existent phenomena.
If one does not ascertain the mind, even though one accumulates merit, doesn't that [just] lead to temporary happiness?
If one does not realize the mode of existence of the mind - the meaning of emptiness - one cannot attain the joy of Liberation by means of one's collection of merit. Although that may act as a cause for the joys up to the Peak of Cyclic Existence, the collection of merit is not perfected, And, on the other hand, if one does not have knowledge of knowable objects but only realization of the emptiness of the mind, how can one be a Buddha? If that were possible, there would be Buddhas in the Nirvana of Listeners, for which there is realization of emptiness alone, and there would also be Buddhas in empty space. But how could there be Buddhas there? Thus the assertion of all the Sutras and Tantras is that Buddhahood occurs through knowledge of all knowable objects and through realization that there is no inherent nature to be realized, i.e. knowing that of which there is nothing to be known,
At what point does one have the certainty of attaining Enlightenment?
Some people realize the emptiness of the mind alone, but have not perfected the qualities of the Method aspect of the training. Some have such qualities, but do not realize the emptiness of the mind. Some have both, but they are not able to guide their practice of the Method with their knowledge. Some have the other qualities, but since they lack the lineage of blessing, they are unable to generate the Clear Appearance. Thus, I fear that Buddhahood is far from them. Since I have a number of these attributes, I hope to attain Enlightenment, but not by the swift means.
This concludes my responses to the questions of the contemplative Nyimo Gomchen.
(This unedited translation was prepared under the guidance of Lama Tashi Namgyal by B. Alan Wallace (Gelong Jhampa Kelsang) at ©Sakya Thubten Kunga Choling in Victoria, B.C., August 1984).
Edited by Souladarity 2009-03-02 6:44 AM
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| Hi, Mr. neel and all of you have brought in good perspective on SR. Few points from myside: "Who am I?" is question that can lead to it. As mind is very limited, as it cannot go beyong Time, Space and casualty of cause and effect, it's imperative that it be kept quite or otherwise, be good servent as supposed to be a master. Generally three states of consciousness pre-dominates in every day life - Wake, sleep, dreamless sleep. I woud say, "wake" following by "sleep full of dream" while 'THAT' exists in all three states. However, there is another state called 'TURIYA' where it can take us beyond the conditions of time, space and cause/effect. It's my understanding that in that Turiya state, one comes to all there is to know. Yoga, meditation leads to that state and rest is only experienced.
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| perhaps, that's why it's called "Self Realization" as we are already PURE and PERFECT but mind has been so conditioned that we aren't aware of it. It's not possible through mind as it is the barrier. To transcend mind, becomes really difficult in mordern context unless we lead simple life style. That's why Yoga / meditation becomes important as it attempt to restore the purity. |
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| What is Self-realization? The question begins with the human inquiry. Who Am I?
What is to be realized? The true nature of the Self. Be still and know. In listening to the silence one can discern the real from the unreal, the transient from the eternal. Transcendental knowledge the only truth that can answer your question comes from silence and appears as grace.
Self- realization arises in the heart of those who surrender to the Divine within, that is without beginning or end. Enlightenment is your natural state of being. There is nothing to be realized. You are all that you seek.
"In order to transcend the darkness of ignorance, we must become the light of the truth." Santi Devi
santidevi
Edited by santidevi 2009-06-02 3:41 PM
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| selt realization is something like a check list to your self ...  |
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| jermay88 - 2006-09-02 3:08 PM
What does it mean when it states 'self realization'? Is it something to do with seeing the world as it is? Wouldnt this be more down the lines of meditation?
It is seeing the world more clearly through yourself. It is self understanding. "Know thy Self." - and that doesn't mean through your ego. Die to yourself and you will experience self realization through the Divine. Meditation definitely helps to put things in perspective to understanding the world through your own understanding and not through anyone else's. |
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Self realization?
