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| I am training for a january 08 1/2 marathon and then a full marathon in March 08.
I want long lean muscles for running. Will yoga provide that for me? If so how much weight training, if any, should I incorporate with yoga and my runs?
Any advice would be greatly appreciated. I completed my first 8K on this past St Patty's Day and was hooked!!! I was sidelined by surgery about 3 months ago and am now having to go back to square one for my runs. I have heard that yoga is amazing for you if you are a runner so I want to make sure I am building good muscle as well.
Thanks so much.  |
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| That is an excellent question and I fear you may not receive a clear answer.
Running and yoga are the perfect combination, at least for me. I really enjoy both and they work in a yin/yang sorta way for me and for many others. However, I still do lift free weights (quite frankly, dumbbells). That also seems to fit well into my equation. I go to a gym for the treadmill (it's too hot to run in south Florida in July) and for the weights. The trainers (my husband is one) are always pushing the Nautilus machines at me yet when I put them on the spot about it they can't really tell me why that is. The fact is that the machines don't do a whole lot for you unless you're an absolute beginner who needs help with form and stability or if you're a veteran coming back from an injury. So I stick with the dumbbells. I used dumbbells for years at home and loved the fact that I could do 100 exercises with them and get great results. If I wasn't going to this gym I would likely forgo weights at this point but, hey, I'm there. Why not use them?
Now Ashtanga/Flow yoga will give you an awesome amount of sculpting without a whole lot of bulk. I'm a girl. I'm not wanting bulk. Your fitness goals are known by you and only you. If you're male and you want to look like Hulk Hogan yoga ain't gonna do it. Also, Iyengar and some of the other "non flow" styles of yoga don't put as much emphasis on upper body strength. If you're looking to omit other forms of strength training I recommend you find a good flow yoga/ashtanga teacher and talk to them about your goals, take a few classes.
I hope I have helped. I'm sure someone else will disagree with me but we all come to this forum with our own personal experiences and our own body types, goals, etc. No one is really right or wrong here and we all learn from what others share.
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| Consdiering your goals of running, I congratulate you on what you have accomplished so far and wish you all the best in accomplishing where you are going. As for lean muscles, but moreover for taking proper precaution in terms of health and safety of fitness, I suggest you take a private session with an experienced teacher. And, my last suggestion is do not compromise health while trying to achieve laurels in running. I mean do not run out of health due to running!
Katie71 - 2007-07-15 2:34 PM
I am training for a january 08 1/2 marathon and then a full marathon in March 08.
I want long lean muscles for running. Will yoga provide that for me? If so how much weight training, if any, should I incorporate with yoga and my runs?
Any advice would be greatly appreciated. I completed my first 8K on this past St Patty's Day and was hooked!!! I was sidelined by surgery about 3 months ago and am now having to go back to square one for my runs. I have heard that yoga is amazing for you if you are a runner so I want to make sure I am building good muscle as well.
Thanks so much. |
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| yoga helps lean muscles and helps ur breathing so when u run u get less tired and u feel much better to
and weight training really dosn't matter for yoga mostly just for the running (well at least for me
i think only cause my coach makes us weight train)
may i ask
i am also a runner (lol for the furture ) still to young to be in a marathone alwell
do u have to train for marathones |
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| "Lean muscles." Ow, sore subject. I bet if you took a poll, you'd find lots of women runners who wouldn't mind looking like Arianna Lambie, and males who'd trade-in for Haile Gebrselassie.
Problem is, you are who you are.
It's easy to spot a "real-deal" runner from a half-mile away. Long legs, wonderful natural form, exceptional aerobic capacity (yes, they aren't breathing hard at 6:00 pace).
Now then - is that you? Only 10 percent of runners, according to a Univ. of Louisiana study, have "highly trainable" bodies. Eighty percent have bodies that are trainable across a span of "average" trainability. And 10 percent have bodies that are barely trainable at all.
If you're in the lucky 10 percent, you'll have no trouble looking like a runner. Whether you do, won't really matter, because you'll be able to bury us "normals" and possibly even finish in the top 10 percent in your first 8K.
But if you aren't, what are you going to do? Sit down and cry? World-class talent is a question of DNA - and so is "local talent." Great runners are not made; they are born. This is documented fact.
Joy comes by stretching our own edges, not pretending to be someone else. What's most satisfying for a runner is to have the feeling, when you train and race, that you're doing it right. That feeling comes when you don't over- or under-train. And when you have that feeling, you'll improve.
That much said, if you want to have slim legs, here are some things you can do:
(1) avoid lower-body weights - I trained for Western States 100 on hills and using the slant leg-press machine at the gym - worked up to 5 sets of 12 peaking at 12x650 lbs - my legs were trail tigers, but they were big.
(2) Do speedwork. Your body adapts to the kind of work you give it - speedwork takes fat off your legs (completely unscientific, but it seems to work). The type of speedwork doesn't really matter. You haven't been running long, though - so be careful. Probably quarter-miles at tempo pace would be enough (85-92% of maximum heart rate).
(3) Eat tons of salad, tons of fruit, tons of beans, virtually no starchy carbs (use dates and figs, etc. instead), and moderate amounts of nuts, other healthy fats, and protein. You'll lose weight, feel great, and look like a runner (hey, even if you've got the aerobic capacity of a hippo, it's fun to be thin).
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| That's great info, actually. I have another off-the-subject question. I'm a vegetarian. I eat dairy and eggs, too, but try to aim for a "plant based" menu. You seem to know something about fitness and nutrition. I'm having trouble finding a diet that doesn't contain meat AND is low in starchy foods. What do you recommend? I have 15 lbs I'd like to get rid of. |
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| Hi Katie.
I have no business answering your question here because I have such strong feelings about the bio-mechanics of running and its effects on joints/connective tissue. It is frequently a hot button subject. I often debate with a close friend of mine who is a well-educated certified strength trainer. Yoga versus training. And I, now a yoga teacher, was a basketball coach for 17 years and ran several strength and conditioning programs for our men's team.
As I've said elsewhere, I perceive yoga as a counter to running, cycling, swimming, jogging, cross-country skiing, etcetera. Many of these things (while they may be great and may feel great) are movements in only one plane with only two actions - flexion and extension of the hips (thigh bones). since the thigh bone also adducts, abducts, internally rotates and externally rotates these aforementioned "exercises" work only two of six possible movements (primarily, not exclusively). So the work itself is only 33% of the possibility from a standpoint of hip wellness.
Additionally, when one runs with poor alignment or bio-mechanics - leaning to one side, excessive eversion or inversion of the ankle, limits in flexion/extension ROM or excessive rotations of the femurs, the risks for joint damage is multiplied. One therefore, in my opinion, should train to run, not run to train. Get a pro to anaylize your gait and stride so you are running well - much more important than finishing first as that is only temporary. The rest you keep for life.
And I've yet to mention the g-force pounding overtime from poor footwear, improper surfaces, or the fact that anthropologically we are constructed to run barefooted so we have the appropriate proprioceptive feedback from the earth through the soles (without a buffer called Nike).
If you define what "long lean muscle" means to you it might be possible to answer just that question. Unfortunately terms like that seem to mean different things to different people. Are you talking about the distance of the muscle from origin to insertion (long)? Are you talking about a percentage of body fat surrounding the muscles tissue (lean)?
I would "do" an asana practice anyway not so much to perform better in the marathon, though that may ultimately happen. But to keep the body healthy from the inside out as you pursue your running interests over time.
Katie71 - 2007-07-15 11:34 AM
I am training for a january 08 1/2 marathon and then a full marathon in March 08.
I want long lean muscles for running. Will yoga provide that for me? If so how much weight training, if any, should I incorporate with yoga and my runs?
Any advice would be greatly appreciated. I completed my first 8K on this past St Patty's Day and was hooked!!! I was sidelined by surgery about 3 months ago and am now having to go back to square one for my runs. I have heard that yoga is amazing for you if you are a runner so I want to make sure I am building good muscle as well.
Thanks so much.
Edited by purnayoga 2007-07-25 1:45 PM
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| PurnaYoga,
You have a wealth of information and I enjoy reading your posts. I have a question for you. Do you practice yoga exclusively or crosstrain with another "exercise" form?
After 20 years of running injuries and alignment issues I have developed a love-hate relationship with running and have considered giving it more times than I can count.
I'm wondering if the flow/ashtanga yoga I practice will give me a satisfactory "cardio" benefit.
What do you think? |
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| That is very kind of you.
Hopefully though I'm more than an encyclopedia.
Do I cross train? Not really. I walk. Mostly in the better weather here in Seattle. A distance of about 3 miles on relatively flat terrain with a pace that allows me to enjoy what I am doing. I do this several times a week. But I do it to move my body, be outside, and only slightly for the calories that burn doing it.
Recently I've taken to the rowing machine. Why? It allows me to move all my limbs (though still in one plane so it must be countered) and it provides the pulling work for the arms which is seemingly so missing on many asana styles/disciplines/practices. Thirty minutes of that three times a week is less enjoyable than the walk outside but I'm experimenting with the results.
I have, in the past, played basketball and played rather hard. Intense. And for hours at a time. I have all the mile markers to prove it; sprained ankles, repaired knee ligament, wonky sacrum. So I've simply had to stop the activity. Some would say I should train to do the activity and those folks are entitled to their opinions. I just don't share it.
It strikes me as odd that people train to train. I mean the work we do in our lives is our training. It is our fitness. Picking up your toddler IS your bicep curls. So going to the gym to curl dead weight when you can curl live weight strikes me as "odd". But humans are fascinating for this very reason.
My friend Tim trains in case he has to run to catch a bus. I'd prefer to either arrive there on time or catch the next one.
As for cardio benefit I'm still exploring this as well. Heart health in our tiny minds is fairly one dimensional. We must move at rate x. But I can't help but wonder if surya namaskar, pranayama, and the proper standing poses aren't heart health enough. I simply do not know. Yet at the same time I do not, at all trust western medicine to tell me.
To my knowledge Iyengar doesn't do the Starimaster and yet he's living well into his 80's. Of course he has been known to practice asana for 8 hours a day so perhaps that's his cardio. I think the yogic perspective on heart health, generally speaking, is radically different than the one we embrace.
So perhaps the larger question is "can I have a healthy heart without jumping around".
With the proper diet, the proper lifestyle, the proper asana, the proper meditation, the proper pranayama, I believe you can. Most people do not want to do this so cardio may be best for them.
Miabella704 - 2007-07-27 3:50 PM
PurnaYoga,
You have a wealth of information and I enjoy reading your posts. I have a question for you. Do you practice yoga exclusively or crosstrain with another "exercise" form?
After 20 years of running injuries and alignment issues I have developed a love-hate relationship with running and have considered giving it more times than I can count.
I'm wondering if the flow/ashtanga yoga I practice will give me a satisfactory "cardio" benefit.
What do you think?
Edited by purnayoga 2007-07-27 7:55 PM
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| Beryl Bender Birch` s book power yoga is an excellent book to read if you are into running, she calls her programme the "official yoga programme of the new york road runners club" Its a must if you are into other forms of fitness such as running, cycling, skiing etc
you will love it !! |
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| Thanks, Raquel! I'm seeing so many instructors teaching yoga classes specifically for athletes. I think it's a wonderful way for runners and other athletes to achieve balance in their bodies and lives. |
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| Miabella704 - 2007-07-27 6:50 PM After 20 years of running injuries and alignment issues I have developed a love-hate relationship with running and have considered giving it more times than I can count. I'm wondering if the flow/ashtanga yoga I practice will give me a satisfactory "cardio" benefit. What do you think? Miabella, I know exactly what you mean by that love-hate relationship with running. Though my collection of injuries, while affecting my running over the years, never exactly stemmed from the running per se (eg. kickboxing, strength training, etc.). This past year, with my newest of ailments (an SI instability), I pretty much gave up running and only practiced yoga, of many various styles and intensities, and would you believe what happened? I gained 10 lbs. Go figure. I also found, without the running, that energetically something was missing for me. Maybe it's my doshic tendency that needs the running (the kapha part of my overly kapha-pitta disposition). As much as the running is tough on my physical body, I'm finding my other subtle bodies benefit when I run, and much more than any other cardio activity I may do (walking, biking, teaching high-intensity interval fitness classes, etc.). Just last week I was contemplating putting away my running sneakers for good, I was so discouraged with my inability to complete my regular route (close to 6 miles). Then I went out to the park one more time, just for kicks, I guess. Even gave up taking yoga class that morning, thinking maybe that was the issues (taking too many classes rather than doing my own practice). I ran the route, came home and did my own practice, and things just seemed to mesh right. So I guess my point is, while many runners find that yoga complement their running, I'm finding that running is complementing my yoga. I'm almost dumbfounded by that fact, but I'm going to stick with it regardless of how it almost doesn't make sense. Now all I have to do is figure out how to stick with the running even when it's raining out! 
Edited by OrangeMat 2007-07-29 7:28 AM
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| Yes, running is also quite addictive. I can't give it up. Not entirely. I try to run on either the beach or the treadmill to keep the joint damage to a minimum.
The original question asked in this post was whether or not yoga can replace weights as strength training. Lots of us have asked this at one point or another. I'm going to just run and practice ashtanga for the next three months. By the first week of November I'll see how I feel. I may have to extend it another three months to really see the results. We'll see how it goes.
I'll report the results back here. |
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| Miabella704 - 2007-07-29 10:59 PM The original question asked in this post was whether or not yoga can replace weights as strength training. I believe so, absolutely. I was an avid weight lifter for many years, and the transition to only using body weight came very naturally for me. However, I don't believe yoga can replace cardio, well, for me, that is. Now according to certain yogic philosophy that I've come across, the only reason that I would need extra cardio exercise is because my food intake and my standards for what I want my body to look like are both too high. So it's not the caliber or intensity of my asana practice, but my attitude itself. Interesting, eh? |
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| Yoga will not give you the same as weights. I practiced weights for about 10 years and my body was much firmer and I had bigger muscles, however I was quite tight in the shoulders and hips, I took up yoga to help me with this (and also because I was pregnant) I carried on doing both together for four years and then decided to dedicate my time to yoga (for the next 4 years)
I also practice pilates reformer and mat, - my body is definately different than when I just did weights but I prefer it |
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| raquel - 2007-07-30 7:48 AM I practiced weights for about 10 years and my body was much firmer and I had bigger muscles, Interesting. My muscles are still the same size: well-defined and working toward being lean. Since my body is the type that tends to bulk up very easily with the use of heavy weights, even though I've always been strong enough to lift them, I'd tend to hold back on that a bit. In fact, my very first experience in the weight room over 20 years ago, was after only 4 months of lifting, I was asked to join a weight-lifters' competition! So I guess from the get-go I was mindful of my muscling-up potential, though probably not consciously so. So that's why my transition to body-weight based strength training (pre-yoga) came naturally for me, and with the same physical results. Different body types all around, for sure. |
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| Yes I too build muscle very easy, I just find my body to be more functionally strong and flexible, dont get me wrong I still have excellent definition and tone, but my body feels different. Maybe I lost the weight through sheer ammount of practice. |
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| Ok, I could lose firmness. Now THAT does scare me. I'm 37 but look younger and care to keep it that way. Hmmmmm.
Raquel, what kind of yoga do you practice? That could be the reason for losing muscle/firmness.
I'm hoping ashtanga alone can keep me firm. |
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Runners and Yoga
