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 Ashtanga = danger to joints?Moderators: Moderators Jump to page : 1 Now viewing page 1 [25 messages per page] | View previous thread :: View next thread |
| Yoga -> Ashtanga Yoga | Message format |
summerrain |
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Hello YogINis  ! I'm new to this community and I've been browsing through many threads with interesting posts for quite a while, coming to the conclusion, I'll just start a new one :-). Well, I'm a 23 years old and started practicing Asthanga about 10 months ago, first only 1-2x/week, since May/June about 4-6x a week for about 2h. I haven't done any Yoga before that and not much other sports either, maximum of going for a 1h run 1x/week in summertime. I've really enjoyed my practice so far and I'm really interested in getting deeper into the whole "Yoga-Matrix" (not only Asana). Anyway, to come to the point, during the last months, every now and then I've experienced some discomfort in different body parts. (e.g. at one point I felt some pain in my hip when getting up from forwardbends etc, my teacher reassured me though, that it was only a sign of my hips starting to open, and after a while the pain was gone...). It was about 2 weeks ago when I started to feel some discomfort doing forwardbends, particularly in the inner side of my knees (I think it's called hollows? - or are these my Hamstrings? - sorry, got no clue  ). What's more,a couple of days ago my right leg kind of slipped off when moving up from Ardha Baddha Padmottanasana, which didn't feel to good on my knee either :-/. Besides I think I might be overextending my knees sometimes when going into Padmasana...  As a result of the above, I feel some discomfort in my knees now, even when not practicing asanas, during the day. So, the thing is that I'm starting to get worried that if I keep practicing for a longer time, I might slowly be ruining my knees (and maybe also other body parts) by doing Ashtanga Yoga, rather than doing good to my body  - and I REALLY don't like that thought coz I love practicing!!! So: what advice could you give an rather " fresh" Ashtanga-Yogini to avoid causing permanent damage to her body? (which I believe, or rather hope, I haven't caused yet....) As I believe there are many experienced practicioners/teachers in this forum, I would really appreciate to hear your thoughts and advice! Thanks for reading and have a nice evening, Alisha PS: Sorry for any language-mistakes, as you can probably guess I'm not native English-speaking. Even though my English is pretty good, it's far from flawless and I particularly have a hard time dealing with all those anatomy-terms (which I probably wouldn't even know in my mother-tongue  ) | |||
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| summerrain |
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| Nick |
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    Location: London, England | |||
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| summerrain |
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| Hi Nick! Thanks for your reply. I don't actually feel pain when in Padmasana, just felt like a bit of "pressure" or strain, which would ease away after a while, but nothing that seemed to really endanger my knees... Maybe you're right and it's really been too much and my hips aren't open enough. I guess I should also try to keep my knees slightly bent during paschimottanasana and janu-series. I wasn't aware that by trying to fully extend them I might be hurting my knees...  Well, I'm trying but sometimes I really find it hard to completely get rid of the ambition to "master" certain poses and to fully get the "comparing with others" out of my head. But I'm getting more aware of it and I think that's a first step.  Alisha | |||
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| Nick |
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Location: London, England | summerrain - 2008-08-29 8:17 AM Hi Nick! Thanks for your reply. I don't actually feel pain when in Padmasana, just felt like a bit of "pressure" or strain, which would ease away after a while, but nothing that seemed to really endanger my knees... Maybe you're right and it's really been too much and my hips aren't open enough. I guess I should also try to keep my knees slightly bent during paschimottanasana and janu-series. I wasn't aware that by trying to fully extend them I might be hurting my knees... Well, I'm trying but sometimes I really find it hard to completely get rid of the ambition to "master" certain poses and to fully get the "comparing with others" out of my head. But I'm getting more aware of it and I think that's a first step. Alisha Hi Alisha, Anatomy is indeed a difficult subject to master-so I try to give my students simple rules-one rule is "feel the effects of asana in the muscles, not in the joints." This applies both during and after exercise. Don't feel it in your joints! Nick | ||
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| tourist |
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Expert Yogi Posts: 8442   | Hi and welcome. I agree that, as a student, you do not need to have extensive anatomy knowledge. That is your teacher's job. And even teachers do not always need an encyclopedic knowledge (I have far less understanding of anatomy than Nick does, for example) but they DO need to know what is safe and unsafe and they DO need to listen to their students and be prepared to give modifications based on what the student is experiencing. The notion that discomfort in the muscles is ok and in the joints not ok is a very good one. A teacher also has to know that if the student describes something as pain s/he has to take that seriously, even if it seems that the student is exaggerating or whatever. I am not a mind-reader. If you say your knees are painful, I need to believe you! I tend to see a "red flag" when I hear things like "that's just opening up the area" or stuff about "ridding the body of toxins" when a student describes something as painful. And if the teacher says "do more and it will improve" I get downright scared. Tell your teacher (again) that you have pain in your knees and ask for modifications. Tell him/her that you don't want to ruin your future dance/running/Cirque de Soliel career with a possible injury or whatever you have to do to get the message through. If you don't get any good advice, find another teacher. Or you can come here and the ashtangis can give you some simple mods so you can keep practicing. You can do janu sirsasana instead of ardha baddha padma pascimottanasana, for example. Yoga needs to nurture you, not harm you. Take care!  oh - and your English is great.  | ||
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| summerrain |
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| hnia |
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tourist - 2008-08-29 7:47 AM I tend to see a "red flag" when I hear things like "that's just opening up the area" or stuff about "ridding the body of toxins" when a student describes something as painful. And if the teacher says "do more and it will improve" I get downright scared. Tell your teacher (again) that you have pain in your knees and ask for modifications. Yoga needs to nurture you, not harm you. Excellent advice for both teachers and students!!! Pain is your body telling you something important in a loud voice. Never ignore or rationalize it. Doing any pose in a manner that causes pain (either during class or later) is doing that pose the wrong way, no matter how closely it resembles that picture in that book, that picture in your head, that teacher, or that great student next to you! We all have unique body/minds and we need to honor that fact both as teachers and as students. | |||
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| Nick |
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Location: London, England | Hi Jim, "The knee joint is not designed to be twisted and twisting it will lead to injury" Sorry to say, but the knee is capable of twisting-in fact, it is designed to do so-in most people it is capable of externally rotating up to 40 degrees, and up to 15 degrees internal rotation. When the knee is fully extended, the joint surfaces lock, and no rotation is possible. There's only one movment the knee isn't capapble of, and that is lateral flexion-it doesn't bend sideways-unless you hit it with a sledghammer, or practice padmasana wrongly it would actually seem prudent, I feel, to take advantage of the external rotation of which the knee is capable, thus re-directing the forces that are generated in a faulty lotus, and instead generating these forces into externally rotating the hip joint-to do this, the knee muscles need to tighten-bringing stability to the knee, and therefore helping to target the hip joints. Just a personal observation, look forward to discussing it with you. take care Nick | ||
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| summerrain |
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| Thanks for you great input JimG! (the "pain is a message" and "unique body"- parts, as well as the" yoga should fit the student"-part). I guess I'd better stick with half lotus for the time being... I can't bring both of my knees to the floor when in Cobbler's pose. When I do Padmasana, my left leg (on top) puts pressure on the right one, I can particularly feel that in my right ankle (doesn't hurt, just not really a comfortable way of sitting ;-)). The right knee is the one troubling me right now. And I'll leave the knee-twisting discussion to you - don't think I can contribute to that | |||
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| Nick |
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Location: London, England | Hi Jim, That's actually pretty good Might borrow it Nick | ||
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| summerrain |
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| Well, I had a good, but rather careful and "soft" practice on Saturday (haven't practiced since then - you know we girls get additional "days off" ). I think sitting in lotus is/was really too much. My yoga teacher from saturday has had troubles with her knees as well and gave me some advice. I will talk to my (more experienced) teachers as well though as soon as they are back... | |||
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