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New User
Posts: 3
| I noticed that sometimes when I put my head all way back for half moon backbend that I hear a nasty-sounding crunch in my neck. It doesn't hurt and actually I sometimes feel a slight tingle in my neck/head area immediately afterwards-the tingle feels good.
I checked that I was doing the pose right. Shoulders are way down and back, and my neck goes back real slow (it crunches as it reaches the point it is furthest back), and then exit real slow too. I tried bending my arms too when I lowered my head, as someone suggested that, but it didn't make a difference.
I asked my teacher about it and she said my technique looked ok and the sound could just be my vertebrae realigning. But I have had some neck pain lately, at the top of the neck. It's not normal muscle-ache pain after working out. I'm kind of at a loss as to what I'm doing wrong as I'm guessing the crunch must be causing the pain? |
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Veteran
Posts: 149
 
| do you tilt first then go back ??? explain what you are doing more it MAY be there on it could be rabbit or any other pose or even dare I say NOTHING to do with yoga LOL are you doing anything new like carying things?
Edited by amyf 2010-09-17 10:22 AM
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| i have big problems with the way that backbend is taught and its location in the series.
your neck sits on top of everything else and it's function is dependent upon the balance and alignment of all parts underneath it. i've had a good deal of neck crunching in my life, some innocuous some troubling and painful, but i always want to go in the direction of more neck crunching to less neck crunching.
if i had to guess i would say that the relationship between your arms, shoulder girdle and lumbar is skewed and throwing your head back in such a backbend pulls it in such a well that it crunches and crackles. you could perhaps back off from your backbend a little, brace your lower back with your hands, and attempt to do the pose more from the expansion of the chest than from the pulling of the arms and neck...think about expanding every rib in the cage, especially the ribs in your armpits, and underneath your breasts and collarbone...the places that you don't normally think, "oh, there are ribs." eventually your back rib cage will have to articulate as well.
i hope any of this helps.
to be perfectly frank i don't feel that bikram yoga is the appropriate venue to do the kind of work described above.
good luck |
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| I agree with what dhanurasana said, but would like to add that even though the room is hot, your muscles are not very warmed up yet for that initial backbend and you need to go easy.
Also, your neck is part of your spine and should be a normal extension of the general spinal movement or shape. Forcing your neck back in backbends of any type will only compress your cervical vertabrae and potentially cause injury. (Forcing your neck forward in any pose is just as bad if not worse as you can stretch the ligaments that hold your head up and then you are in real trouble. This is especially a problem with shoulderstand and plow.)
You only get one neck. Most of your nerves travel through the little vertabrae of your neck. Take good care of it!!!
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Extreme Veteran
Posts: 574
| Good points by dhanurasana and Jim! |
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| It often helps to think of your spine as one long extended arc to avoid hinging at the lower back or the neck. (Since 'hinging' causes compression, it should be avoided.)
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New User
Posts: 3
| Thank you so much for the responses.
I am not doing anything new, and yes I do extend and tilt before going back. My teacher said I was doing the right thing so based on that I don't think it's a problem with technique, although I may ask another one for a second opinion.
I sometimes have some lower back pain and my pelvis has a tendency to misalign, although I know it is ok at the moment. I also have some pain in my right shoulder that comes and goes, so dhanurasana's suggestion that there are issues in the rest of my spine is likely to be accurate. Both those things have been on and off for a long time though, and the neck issue is new.
I will try doing the modification (I'll just let the teacher know beforehand to avoid being told off in class  )
In the past (before I ever had any neck pain) I did hear one teacher say not to put the head all the way back, and to always keep the arms with the ears. It was only one teacher out of the many others I have had though, that taught it like that. I remember wondering why she taught it that way, but now I guess it was to avoid neck injury like this? I tried to do the backbend that way last class as I remembered that alternative, but my teacher told me not to bend back like that until I had put my neck all the way back, and I didn't want to put my neck back as I was scared of crunching, so I just ended up stretching everything up to the ceiling.
Jimg-I just wanted to ask about your last comment. Do you mean by that that in fact we should not be putting the neck all the way back like in that posture at all? In other words, just the act of putting the neck back compresses the vertebrae? Or did you just mean they are compressed if this is done incorrectly, like by not extending first? I just wanted to check.
Thanks! |
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| Heh - see, the funny thing about the internet is that you get people who don't really LIKE Bikram yoga advising you on the right way to do Bikram yoga.
Sounds to me like the biggest problem you're having NOW is that you're scared to go into the backbend! (This happens a lot.) The key in that first backbend is to RELAX and BREATHE. (These are the things that you stop doing when you start stressing out and questioning yourself over technique.)
In the first backbend, you should drop your head back, i.e. relax. It's not being "thrown back" (dhanurasana) or "forced" (jim). And it's NOT "real slow," either. It's just relaxed, all the way back, in one motion. When you try to go super slowly or (heaven forbid) try to keep your head between your ears, you put a lot of unnecessary tension into your neck.
You don't need to be scared of the first backbend. Why? Because your neck is already very well warmed up, or should be. Why? PRANAYAMA BREATHING. Pranayama breathing is a gentle 10-MINUTE-LONG warm up for your neck. The neck flexes and extends 20 times before you get to the first backbend. If you came to me with the question after class as a student, the first thing I'd look at (after the backbend itself) would be your pranayama breathing. Make sure you are using your hands on your chin for leverage, pushing your hands on the chin for the exhale, keeping the spine straight so only arms and head move... etc.
So to make a long story short, my advice as a Bikram yoga teacher is to relax and breathe. Don't over-complicate things and don't make it harder than it needs to be. |
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New User
Posts: 3
| Dancingj-You are totally right that I'm scared to put my head back. It's because I've had other injuries with my spine, and I'm worried this problem is causing another one, and that it might get worse and I might have to stop yoga for a while (as happenned before with another injury)  I'm worried about the crunch as it doesn't sound healthy to me. I don't think it's normal??
Just to clarify, I only started putting my head back that slow after I noticed this problem, and got that advice from a teacher. Before I didn't use to put it back so slow, but I'll try what you said about normal pace.
Re. Pranayama, it's a very good point. Here's this thing (maybe I shoulda mentioned this before)...I used to get the same crunch only in pranayama, but then stopped putting my head 'all the way back' in that and the crunching stopped there, but started in the backbend :S My pranayama feels good now. I do extend back quite a lot, just not 'all the way back'. Also, when I didn't go all the way back in either pranayama or the first backbend, the crunch happenned in camel.
I guess maybe I should go see a physical therapist about this! Will try next week if I can get an appointment. |
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| seriously dude just try a different yoga class/teacher/style. you will likely learn things that will help to address your neck issues, and once you have sufficiently dealt with your neck imbalances, Bikram yoga will still be there. go see a PT, and also look for a yoga teacher in any school of yoga with 20-30 years of teaching experience.
@dancingj: my problem isn't specifically with Bikram yoga, but with practices that cause people to be poorly aligned. my loyalty is to gravity. |
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Veteran
Posts: 149
| well at least the battle this time is tasteful .... (so for lol) but seriously bikram or not yoga or not if you are concerned about a health issue the internet is REALLY not the best place for concrete advice...... see your doctor and listen to your body and do what YOU feel is right.
I LOVE Bikram but you will always find people who differ in opinions about what what they feel we should be doing. This is a great site to talk technique or advice but if you are truly concerned about your health...... you should go see someone. |
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| and to clarify, dancingj i like you very much. i'm very glad that you have had so much success with Bikram yoga and am proud to say i sort of know you. I hope that every yoga practitioner (Bikram or not) will have as much earnestness, zeal, and success as you have in one finger.
however when someone is having problems which are not responding/getting worse in Bikram yoga (such as myself 6ish years ago), it is important that they know about/explore other options. |
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Expert Yogi
Posts: 5098
Location: Somewhere in the Mountains of Western NC | Where is the LIKE button..I also agree with Jim and Andrew (Dhan). I'm not a Bikram hater or disliker either, I love it....but, I also have seen too many people injure themselves without much guidance within the various Bikram studios. If you take good alignment skills and merge them with Bikram, you will have an incredible practice!!!
As for this posture and the neck...only take your neck as far as you can go while breathing comfortably, don't strain and push - contrary to what is taught. This is very simple. It's interesting how everyone wants to get into that posture before its their body's time. Be patient, it's very important to slowly reach the goal - this is where you set yourself up for injury and sometimes you don't notice it till much later when its harder to make the connection of what went wrong and you may not associate it with this particular posture because you went and did something else wrong and started a huge domino effect of injuries piling on each other. Your body is not used to being in these postures and its very important to acclimate to it. Besides, if you do it the correct way, one day you will find yourself going back further than you can ever imagine - naturally and without much effort (and no cricking and crunching either) trust me!!
Best wishes.
Edited by Cyndi 2010-09-20 11:09 AM
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| yogurtgirl - 2010-09-17 9:46 PM
Jimg-I just wanted to ask about your last comment. Do you mean by that that in fact we should not be putting the neck all the way back like in that posture at all? In other words, just the act of putting the neck back compresses the vertebrae? Or did you just mean they are compressed if this is done incorrectly, like by not extending first? I just wanted to check.
Thanks!
If you look like [ instead of ( (both rotated 90 degrees forward) with the lower back and neck hinged, you are putting a lot of pressure on two vertebral disks instead of evenly distributing that weight and pressure over the length of the entire spine.
I am not sure what "putting the neck all the way back" means. As long as the neck is extended, relaxed and does not hinge, I think it should be OK. It is the forcing and hinging that are problematic. |
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Neck crunch
